snw blue by you Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Help please! I am a little out of my league on this. It has an Allison trans, I verified the starter relay and starter work using a remote. I know there is no VDC at the S term on relay (r/bl) and that the fuses in the CJB are ok, but there is this pesky thing called a starter inhibit relay that may be causing the problem, I swaped for a known good relay but to no avail. How does this thing work or rather why would the PCM fail to switch on the ground. The truck was towed in due to a multiple stall but restart, then after approx the sixth time it would do nothing. This happened durring Friday night's snowstorm while it was plowing. I realize that if the PCM sees a gear it will not allow a start but that would not cause the stall, unless of course I am dealing with multiple issues. I am not equipped with the IC4 cable, so I am winging it until said cable shows up. Right now it is stuck outside but I sure would like to get it in the shop, pushing is out because of the sander. I have looked at TSB 06 13 03 and inspected the connectors but I did not find any corrosion or breaks. Any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Bruene Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Why don't you key it on, and jump the starter relay underhood and drive it in? The only VT that I can recall with a similar issue had an open in one of the fuse holders on top of the batteries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snw blue by you Posted February 26, 2008 Author Share Posted February 26, 2008 I jumped the relay, crank, no start. As I said maybe there are multiple issues. Looking at the wire diagram it appears that the switched PCM ground is also used for the IPR, which as we know if not allowed to duty cycle will not allow pressure to be built. No start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 Good for you we are supposed to get some ice and rain today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Amacker Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 That truck is probably wired more like an IH than a Ford. You don't have an interface cable to run MD, right? Check the power circuits going to the ECM and FICM. I'd either voltage drop them or apply a load to them to verify they can handle amperage. Common problems- corroded power wires and pitted relay contacts that pass voltage but not amperage. Does it rattle the injectors at KOEO? Big snowstorm this morning- all schools are closed and plows are going strong. East cost people beware- you're next! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony302600 Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 we only got 4-6 inches /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smhair.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 At my house I got around 5" on the ground this morning, here at work it's more like only 3". Supposed to get at least another 2-3 by tonight. Looks like I'll be out on the Artic cat tonight /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hempstead Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 I had one in last month same concern, died while driving, then no crank, I chased wires forever and ended up replacing the pcm to fix it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hempstead Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 I just had to open my mouth. The same truck just got towed back in for the same concern no crank no pcm communication. I honestly thought it was fixed. they have had it for over a month and have drove almost 1500 miles. Maybe the snow has something to do with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony302600 Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 I'm sorry but thats funny hempstead.... I've had the happen all too often.... BTW where is El Paso IL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hempstead Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 El Paso is 20 miles north of Bloomington/Normal and about 30 east of Peoria. Maybe I missed something on my wiring checks. the evtm for 650's is different from paper to online and hotline doesn't help much. I at least have the break-out-box for these trucks. Hopefully it will be something simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastendpowerstroke Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Does a 6.0L equipped truck have the power and ground feeds directly from the battery like the CAT and CUMMINGS trucks do? If so check the wiring where there tie strapped to the standoffs in front of the battery box where they wrap under the frame for crushed wires. Unfortunately the truck salesman had a hardon for CAT motors so I think we only sold 1 F-650 with a 6.0L so I don't know if the wirings the same. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/shrug.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Dave, I believe but will check for sure, the chassis harness is the same for the power and ground systems on these trucks. The big difference is the engine and transmission harness'. Jim, don't trust the publications on these harness' you will get the wrong info. I think it was a communication problem between the manufacturers and the vendors for good info. Even if you have the engineering tag off of the harness. Motor City Ford owns about 7-8 wrong harness' because of the tag. You have to call it in to the help desk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 I am currently involved with 5 2008 F750's with big problems. Earlier this week I replaced the OEM/ECM harness for a C-7 CAT. Nobody seems to be able to give accurate information on these trucks but I can tell you from my research that the ECM power and ground circuits originate from the batteries and end in a two pin connector near the starter for all three engines. The wires look like they are about 8 or 10 gauge wires, BK/WT and BK/GN and the OEM harness side has a tag on the harness that says "ENGINE ECM CONN." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastendpowerstroke Posted March 1, 2008 Share Posted March 1, 2008 Keith I just looked a the evtm for a 2006 F-650 and all three show a C1454A at the + battery and C1454B and the - battery. I've said it before it's the first thing I check for almost any F-650 F-750 engine or trans concern. there tie strapped so tight to the plastic brackets that it cuts the wiring insulation and turns green. on edit I see you said 2008 not 2006 but it still shows the b+ feed for 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snw blue by you Posted March 2, 2008 Author Share Posted March 2, 2008 I was at school the end of last week so I have had no progress, however before I left on Tue evening I noticed a bunch of harnesses split open and the wiring contained within split open and the presence of severe corrosion. I also noticed the back of the CJB shows water intrusion. When I get in tomorrow I will call the customer and have him come and look at it and decide what to do. I am thinking harness and CJB replacement, along with other misc. components. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted March 2, 2008 Share Posted March 2, 2008 Have fun. That harness sucks to do. I highly suggest that you remove the harness with the brackets still strapped to the harness. Then, put the old and new harnesses on a bench, PRE-BEND the harness where it goes down around the starter and transfer the brackets. I had a really hard time bending the harness properly and getting the harness strapped to the harness properly. This is important because the harness runs directly in front of the battery cables and studs on the starter motor. A chafe there will cause big problems as you could imagine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hempstead Posted March 4, 2008 Share Posted March 4, 2008 Keith would you have the part # for the ecm power harness that goes from the battery to the connectors by the starter? My parts guys are having trouble finding it and there are no harness tags. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted March 4, 2008 Share Posted March 4, 2008 These harnesses are built to order by the vin#. My parts guy used HVBOM to find the correct number for me. You need a different harness than I did, I looked for a basic part number to get you pointed in the right direction but couldn't decide which is the right one. Look on cell-9 in the EVTM for harness layout information. I'll let you make the decision. I suggest looking at the truck and figuring out what else is part of that harness, I want to say it is one of the battery cables... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snw blue by you Posted March 5, 2008 Author Share Posted March 5, 2008 I was told three of the four I was looking for are not available and that repair is done by overlay. The harness numbers were 7C708 14305 or 12B637 1844084 14406 Apparently only the 12B637 is available, and should be the main engine harness. Any of you truck guys willing to have this confirmed for me? Thanks, Steph. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 I was told three of the four I was looking for are not available and that repair is done by overlay. Where did that information come from? These harness' are not stocked, they are built to order. I had to wait for mine to be made and shipped from the factory in Mexico. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hempstead Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 My parts guy told me that the harness I need is a 14406. That is what parts assistance told him. I needed the ecm power feed harness. I am know just waiting on the customer to approve it. The harness is built to vin and is like 800 bucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snw blue by you Posted March 5, 2008 Author Share Posted March 5, 2008 Originally Posted By: snw blue by you I was told three of the four I was looking for are not available and that repair is done by overlay. Where did that information come from? These harness' are not stocked, they are built to order. I had to wait for mine to be made and shipped from the factory in Mexico. Keith, this is what I was told by parts but now that I have your info I will recheck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Be sure to get names and times that you call. We had one that took 3 tries to get the right harness, Ford fought with us when we went to return the wrong harness's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 What year is this truck anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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