'07 F-250 P2291

[mchan68]

Well, guys I got yet another coming in on the hook. What catches my attention is that it's an '07 model year. I thought that all '07 model years come from the factory already equipped with the one-piece HPOP outlet. Another thing that I find interesting is he also requested to have an oil change done with 5W40 synthetic. Is there any possibility that oil might be too thin to run in these ambient temperatures during this time of year? Could that contribute to the no-start due to being too thin of a grade, making it more difficult to build and maintain ICP?

[Fredsvt]

Just thought I'd mention, that a 5w40 synthetic HD diesel oil, depending on who makes it and what its specs are is no thinner at high temps than a conventional 15w40. Actually it could be thicker at high temps if it's a quality HD oil than conventional oil.

 

Kevin McCartney over on iATN is and has been trying to teach basics on modern engine lubrication. There's so much to learn, wish I could attend one of his classes.

 

You need to find out what brand of oil the customer has been using, and look up the specs on the oil manufacturer's website to determine whether it is suitable for a high shear diesel engine.

[Keith Browning]

Mike, Someone here informed some time ago about the fitting when we first learned of it. The fitting started going into V8 engines starting with Engine ser# 431736 on 2/9/07. That is the best info I have for you. In any event, this means that not all 2007 model trucks will have the new part.

[Tony302600]

I was told only 08 and up E-series 6.0's had it.

[mchan68]

Well, after catching up with a few of my other "appointments", I finally had the chance to go and view the actual PIDs while trying to get this thing to fire cold. For this first time (for me), I was unable to start it using an "alternative fuel source" and noticed ICP would only climb as high as 13 psi with IPR# maxed out at 85%. Rather than chance overheating the starter, I told my SM to arrange to have it towed into my bay. I thought okay, another badly blown STC. As soon as I pressured it up, I heard a LOUD leak from bank #1, so I thought, okay another dummy rail plug. NOT! Came across my first injector to blow its top just like you see in the photos in the articles under ICP leaks. That explains why the ICP leak issues on this vehicle at such low mileage (47,650 kms.). Replaced the injector, air tested again, this time no leak. Get it all buttoned up. Onto repair #2, complaint of coolant blowing out of degas bottle. Pressure tested the cooling system, no sign of pressure loss even after 45 minutes with the pressure tester hooked up. Check and adjusted coolant to proper level. Drove the vehicle home and noticed the fan clutch cycling off and on through a couple stretches of the highway portion of the journey. Sure enough, as soon as I arrived home to check the coolant, man oh man did that cap ever make a loud POP!!! My question is, can an EGR/oil cooler fail at such low mileage, let alone head/gasket issues? I remember reading a thread somewhere, where someone here mentioned the possibility of the EGR cooler passing a visual and pressure test, but would fail when up to operating temperature. Could this be the case here? If it is an EGR cooler tomorrow, should I also replace the STC fitting with the update since I'm "in there" already?

[Tony302600]

FYI..The injector top's blow off like that because of low fuel pressure. Correct fuel pressure acts like a cushion for the internals of the injectors, if its low, it will blow the top off it like you had. MAKE SURE ITS ABOVE SPEC or you will just blow the top off another one.

 

And Yes, anything can happen at any mileage on these things.

[Bruce Amacker]

My question is, can an EGR/oil cooler fail at such low mileage,

 

If the truck was driven with the coolant low, it quickly ruins the EGR cooler.

 

let alone head/gasket issues? I remember reading a thread somewhere, where someone here mentioned the possibility of the EGR cooler passing a visual and pressure test, but would fail when up to operating temperature. Could this be the case here? If it is an EGR cooler tomorrow, should I also replace the STC fitting with the update since I'm "in there" already?

Use a flashlight and a mirror and inspect the V-clamp at the rear of the EGR cooler. See if there is a drop of coolant hanging off of the bottom of it. If there is, replace the cooler.

 

Install a 30psi pressure gauge into a Tee fitting into the coolant degas bottle hose (3/8", I think). Drive the truck and watch the coolant pressure, it should rise gradually while driving aggressively. If the coolant pressure jumps when you go WOT, it usually means the head gaskets are leaking.

 

Good Luck!

 

 

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

[Bruce Amacker]

should I also replace the STC fitting with the update since I'm "in there" already?

PS: Yes, I would.

 

Good Luck!

[mchan68]

Well, I changed both coolers as well as the STC fitting update. As soon as I fired her up, it started idling erratically, but calmed down. As soon as I drove it out the door, it quit and would not restart. ICP now goes up to 3 psi while cranking. Pushed it back into the shop. Re-air tested. Slight leak heard from right bank. Another injector blew its top? It is worthy to mention it won't hold residual pressure. As soon as key is shut down, fuel pressure drops almost immediately. The fuel filters were dirty, but nothing out of the ordinary. This is after I already drove it home last night with no issues. I guess it's coming back apart in the morning.

[Tony302600]

Remember there is a new spec for Fuel pressure on F-series. Make sure its above 45psi at w.o.t. I've found a lot of weak fuel pumps that are fine, but once we get over 3000rpm they drop to 35psi.

[Shlep]

Mike have you gotten anywhere with this one yet? I'm real curious to hear what you find after my little injector adventure.

[mchan68]

Well, after being on and off this vehicle several times throughout the course of the day. I was finally able to air-test is again, this time PROPERLY (the laptop was DEAD after the other guys used it throughout the course of the day). No air leak. Tore it down to where I could access and remove the IPR. The screen was completely sucked in with LOTS of metal (or sand) particles. Got on the phone to coldline, and was told that there have been some cases of "casting material" left in the oil coolers out-of-box. Here is the call log:

8/1/2008 3:30:00 PM - Tech said:

 

Tech is calling to confirm the current situation. The oil cooler was being replaced and the reservoir screen was replaced as well. The reservoir was thoroughly cleaned and the new cooler was installed. After that, the vehicle was started and ran for several minutes, then stalled. The vehicle has not restarted since. ICP was checked and is only around 3 PSI. The IPR was inspected and there is debris present, as well as screen damage. The vehicle was cranked without the IPR and very little flow is present.

 

 

8/1/2008 3:30:00 PM - Hotline recommended:

 

Michael,

We have have reports of a sand type debris found in replacement oil coolers. This sand can contaminate the reservoir and either cover the screen or breach the screen and contaminate the high pressure pump. If that is the case, the oil cooler will have to be removed for cleaning. Also at this time, the screen will have to be replaced as well as the high pressure pump and IPR. While doing so, the reservoir and passage should be thoroughly cleaned and flushed with fresh oil.

 

[mchan68]

Mike have you gotten anywhere with this one yet? I'm real curious to hear what you find after my little injector adventure.

What little injector adventure? Now you got me curious.

[Aaron]

It's real nice that you have to flush brand new parts before you put 'em on.

 

Injector adventure: http://www.forddoctorsdts.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=15333&page=1#Post15333

[Mekanik]

Wow what a pain in the ass. You would think that for the price of theese parts they would have already cleaned debris and sand from them. I mean I first heard of this a while ago, I just figured that the problem was corrected.

[mchan68]

It's real nice that you have to flush brand new parts before you put 'em on.

 

Injector adventure: http://www.forddoctorsdts.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=15333&page=1#Post15333

 

Now, the next question goes: Who or how am I going to get paid for tearing this thing apart again? Who's paying for the expensive new synthetic oil that I just changed, expecting to have it up and running?

[mchan68]

Wow what a pain in the ass. You would think that for the price of theese parts they would have already cleaned debris and sand from them. I mean I first heard of this a while ago, I just figured that the problem was corrected.

Well, apparently it hasn't been corrected. After tearing it apart and draining the reservoir (while making a huge mess of my bay in the process), there was very little if any grit on the new screen that I had replaced. After consulting with one of my "go to" guys on the phone, he suggested cranking the engine over with the IPR removed, and the turbo oil feed tube blocked off, to try and purge the residual crap left inside. When I cranked the engine over, virtually nothing came out of the IPR port, which I guess means the HPOP is trashed. Can't wait 'till Tuesday to get back to this (Monday is a holiday for us).

[Tony302600]

Well, after being on and off this vehicle several times throughout the course of the day. I was finally able to air-test is again, this time PROPERLY (the laptop was DEAD after the other guys used it throughout the course of the day). No air leak. Tore it down to where I could access and remove the IPR. The screen was completely sucked in with LOTS of metal (or sand) particles. Got on the phone to coldline, and was told that there have been some cases of "casting material" left in the oil coolers out-of-box. Here is the call log:

Originally Posted By: hotline

8/1/2008 3:30:00 PM - Tech said:

 

Tech is calling to confirm the current situation. The oil cooler was being replaced and the reservoir screen was replaced as well. The reservoir was thoroughly cleaned and the new cooler was installed. After that, the vehicle was started and ran for several minutes, then stalled. The vehicle has not restarted since. ICP was checked and is only around 3 PSI. The IPR was inspected and there is debris present, as well as screen damage. The vehicle was cranked without the IPR and very little flow is present.

 

 

8/1/2008 3:30:00 PM - Hotline recommended:

 

Michael,

We have have reports of a sand type debris found in replacement oil coolers. This sand can contaminate the reservoir and either cover the screen or breach the screen and contaminate the high pressure pump. If that is the case, the oil cooler will have to be removed for cleaning. Also at this time, the screen will have to be replaced as well as the high pressure pump and IPR. While doing so, the reservoir and passage should be thoroughly cleaned and flushed with fresh oil.

$20 says that warranty will bounce the shit outta that claim. ANd dont forget to get prior approval for the pump /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/boink3.gif

 

Whats with the fuel pressure issue you were having? Still no update on that?

[mchan68]

 

$20 says that warranty will bounce the shit outta that claim. ANd dont forget to get prior approval for the pump /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/boink3.gif

 

I'm making damn sure that all the "Ts" are crossed and the "Is" dotted on this one. I have printed and documented my call to hotline. I will be taking digital photographs on Monday and keeping them on file if necessary.

Originally Posted By: Tony302600

Whats with the fuel pressure issue you were having? Still no update on that?

Don't know yet. Will have to get this thing to actually stay running again to find out.

[Keith Browning]

I'm making damn sure that all the "Ts" are crossed and the "Is" dotted on this one. I have printed and documented my call to hotline. I will be taking digital photographs on Monday and keeping them on file if necessary.

Make sure that you print out Hot-Line call logs as soon as you see them including updates and post repair. I have had problems with disappearing information.

[Shlep]

Originally Posted By: mchan68

I'm making damn sure that all the "Ts" are crossed and the "Is" dotted on this one. I have printed and documented my call to hotline. I will be taking digital photographs on Monday and keeping them on file if necessary.

Make sure that you print out Hot-Line call logs as soon as you see them including updates and post repair. I have had problems with disappearing information.

I've had and seen the same thing happen a few times now, nice ain't it.

[Jim Warman]

I've had and seen the same thing happen a few times now, nice ain't it.

Letting Ford keep all of your documentation on their server is a lot like giving the keys to the henhouse to the fox....

 

On Canadian message board we see post, entire threads and even posters vanish from the face of the earth because they don't fit in either Fords grand scheme or one of their little "cookie cutter" cubbyholes...

 

With the amount of things we are having to get prior approval for... the amount of warranty claims that have a growing list of questions and the increased scrutiny we appear to be the benefactors of, I think Ford is looking for any way to look better to the share holders... even if it means they will do it on the backs of those who, to some degree or another, may 'feel' trapped in the system.

 

The manufacturing segment of the auto industry has been in a state of flux for many years.... of late, it is gaining momentum as the major players swap bed partners, form and break alliances, scramble for market share without knowing what direction to go.

 

At the risk of sounding paranoid, let's not forget "OASIS quick start" and the new guided diagnostics... (just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean Im not being followed).

[2006]

FYI..The injector top's blow off like that because of low fuel pressure. Correct fuel pressure acts like a cushion for the internals of the injectors, if its low, it will blow the top off it like you had. MAKE SURE ITS ABOVE SPEC or you will just blow the top off another one.

 

And Yes, anything can happen at any mileage on these things.

And if there are any pieces missing off the injector, FIND THEM!! before they end up damaging the oil pump and timing cover

[Aaron]

On Canadian message board we see post' date=' entire threads and even posters vanish from the face of the earth because they don't fit in either Fords grand scheme or one of their little "cookie cutter" cubbyholes...[/quote']

 

Or someone gets in there and asses it up. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rofl.gif

[OHNO60]

Had an interesting conversation with an engineer about these hp oil leaks recently occuring. We had a leaker that well to say it sounded like it was leaking out of every friggen oring. Hotline stated retesting the hp oil system without cranking the engine to regain pressure is giving dalse readings. He sayd once you find the main leak, disable the ficm and fuel pump and crank the engine until icp raises and ipr falls, then your good. He stating a large amount of false readings just re-running the air pressure testing without cranking the hp system. Never would of believed it, after thousands of these dam leakers, i have never seen so many multiple location leaks or stubborn leaks.Maybe the cj4 rated oils finally killing the orings?