2006 f250 6.0 losing ficm sync

GregKneupper · November 9, 2008

I am working on a 2006 f250 that has a complaint of bucking and jerking while driving. I have verified the concern and the truck is losing ficm sync while at highway speeds. It is intermittent but I can replicate it everytime I drive it. There are no codes except a fuel delivery error code in the tcm. I have checked all the circuits and cannot find any problems. Cam sensor has been pulled and inspected and there are no problems with it. I am suspecting a wire harness issue but wiggling on it does not show any issues. The truck has 67000 miles on it and is well taken care of. Has anyone had any similar issues like this?

Bruce Amacker · November 9, 2008

Here's all of the Sync stuff I have in my notes:

Using a scan tool, verify the SYNC PID says YES when the engine is running. SYNC is mostly from the CKP sensor. It is possible to have NO CMP signal and still show YES for SYNC.

No SYNC and no RPM signal is usually a CKP problem.

No SYNC with an RPM signal may be the CMP.

Replace both cam and crank sensors the first time, then the harness. This is the best way to get an intermittent one diagnosed.

Excessive rust under the CMP flange cause a hard start cold. Cleaning rust from the block and replacing the CMP a second time was the fix.

On DTS there were 2 that gave CMP/CKP sync error codes. One was a wiped crank thrust bearing that let the crank walk forward and back causing the codes. Another was a loose crank trigger wheel on the front of the crank- tough diag! Check the RPM PID while running and see if it looks erratic, and check end play in the crank.

DTS: Sync codes with a fresh short block

The tech working on truck removed the ckp sensor, and looked into the hole while turning motor over to find a bent tooth. He raised engine and dropped the oil pan down and tried to straighten the tooth (the motor had shifted in the crate while being shipped). He drove it again to find the problem was no better. A call to the hotline finds that the slightest nick in the trigger wheel can cause issues. The only way to get the trigger wheel is to buy a crank! Ford hotline said replacing the crank could cause bedplate issues, which is why the truck is in the shop in the first place. So hotline said put another short block in it.

Diagnosing FICM SYNC:

Diagnose SYNC problems first

FICM SYNC should read YES KOER.

The FICM SYNC circuit relays info from the PCM to the FICM through 2 wiring circuits, CKPO and CMPO.

FICM SYNC problems can be a bad CKP, CMP (electrical or mechanical), PCM, FICM, or harness.

2005 6.0 Would Not Idle…

The EGR valve was stuck open with no EGR DTC! What was odd was that the SYNC dropped out just before it stalled.

Change SYNC and FICM sync into a bar graph and check it for being erratic.

Do you have the SYNC PDF worksheet? I think it's on DTS here somewhere.....

Good Luck!

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GregKneupper · November 10, 2008

the crank does not have any endplay. The rpm pid does not get erratic when the concern happens. The cam sensor has been pulled and inspected. It ohmed out good and there was no physical damage on the sensor. There was not rust behind it causing it to pull out. Fortunately for us in texas we do not see many rust issues. I will try a new cam and crank sensor first. I would not think it is a trigger wheel as you said the rpm signal would be erratic. The only change in it is when the truck does cut off it drops a little rpm due to the engine not running. I feel pretty confident it is in the cam circuit.l have also done a alternator ripple test on it and it passes. There are no other add ons on this truck.

Tony302600 · November 10, 2008

Put the SYNC and FICMSYNC pids in a line graph format so you can see then dropping out. The simple yes and now pids are dumb, but with the graph you can actually see it. That's how i found my buck jerk problem. I replaced the engine harness, cam and crank sensors per hotline. Guy said it's never driven better.

FYI Keith gave me that idea and line looked very scattered from no to yes.

Bruce Amacker · November 11, 2008

Keith just linked this PDF in another post, but here it is in text format. The funny symbols are just bullet points:

CRANK NO START with NO SYNC or NO FICMSYNC PIDs on 6.0L Diesel

Some 03-07 6.0L-equipped vehicles may experience a crank no start, a runs rough concern or stalling with cam or crank sensor codes. Viewing the SYNC and FICMSYNC PIDs in Datalogger will help diagnose this issue. The SYNC PID will show Yes when the CKP and CMP signals are synchronized to the PCM. The FICMSYNC PID will show Yes when the CKPO and CMPO signals are synchronized to the FICM.

Symptoms from a loss of SYNC or FICMSYNC or erratic SYNC or FICMSYNC can include:

• Crank no start with SYNC No and FICMSYNC No.

• Crank no start with SYNC Yes and FICMSYNC No.

• Crank no start with SYNC No and FICMSYNC Yes.

• Crank no start with erratic SYNC or FICM SYNC switching from No to Yes.

• Vehicle stalling, running rough or missing with SYNC or FICM SYNC switching from Yes to No.

For any of these issues, follow the diagnostics listed below. The PCM needs both cam and crank signals to produce a SYNC=Yes. If SYNC=No with a P2614 or P2617, there is most likely a fault with the associated sensor or circuit.

Note: If there are any CAM or Crank codes stored in PCM, run the PPT for those codes before continuing with this procedure. A bad sensor or circuit should be able to be isolated with the appropriate PPT.

Possible Causes:

• Bad cam sensor

• Bad crank sensor

• Signal short to power

• Signal short to ground

• Open circuit

• PCM

• FICM

• Cam (CMP) Gear or Pin

• Crankshaft (CKP) Tone Wheel

Note: The RPM PID can be a good quick indicator or CKP wheel wobble or slop. The RPM PID can read erratically when there is wobble or slop. The scope will also show this issue with variations in CKP signal amplitude. This signal should be fairly consistent at a steady RPM with the exception of the missing tooth.

The IDS oscilloscope is the most accurate device available to check for this type of concern. If there is no oscilloscope available, you can use a DVOM with HZ and Vac settings but it is not as accurate and an oscilloscope is highly recommended. The oscilloscope diagnostics and setup are below.

Oscilloscope Diagnostic Procedure for CKP and CMP

This will check both the crank (CKP) and cam (CMP) signals into the PCM.

Note: The easiest way but not the only way to access the PCM signals is to use a 104 Pin Break-Out-Box (BOB) and an adapter T sold by Rotunda (1-800-ROTUNDA) attached to the middle (46-Pin) connector on the PCM. This allows for easy access to all signals.

Oscilloscope Channel Setup:

• Select Oscilloscope Tools and then Oscilloscope from the IDS toolbox.

• Connect the VMM to the vehicle and the computer to the VMM as shown in the hookup.

• Connect the red probe to C1 on the VMM and then into pin 30, and the black probe to C2 on the VMM and then into pin 31 of the middle PCM connector (1381c), (176c for E-Series). Go to the next step if using a BOB. (You can leave the connector unplugged from the PCM and just probe into the connector. The engine will still crank). Use the IDS probe kit for cranking signals or the IDS Universal probe

(T-015) can be used for running engine signals leaving c1381c or 176c connected.

• Select channel one Auto, then CKP-6.OL Diesel and go the next step (If auto is not available select Manual, Red Probe, 5volts/div, or 20 ms/div if the engine will start).

• Select channel two Auto, then CMP-6.OL diesel and go to next step (If auto is not available select Manual, Black Probe, 500mvolts/div and 100ms/div time-base settings). If the engine will start, change only the time-base to 100ms/dv. Move the channel two trigger approximately half a division vertically up and about three divisions right horizontally.

• Turn the key to on with the engine off and then select Trigger, Type, one Shot and then select the Red Man to turn the scope on. The Red Man will turn to a Green Running Man with the test “Waiting for trigger” in the status area below the signal display. If One Shot is already running when you key up, One Shot will have to be restarted because an unwanted waveform will be captured from the key state change.

• Open the oscilloscope screen to full and crank or start the engine

• One Shot will capture the waveforms automatically. (Turn One Shot off to view the signals live).

• The yellow signal is the CKP and the green signal is the CMP. If CKP and CMP look similar to what is shown below then continue with the rest of diagnosis otherwise stop here and fix the problem signal.

• If the scope does not trigger, reset the trigger points on the second channel and verify that the connections at the PCM connector are solid. If it still won’t trigger, then there is no signal getting to the scope.

Oscilloscope Diagnostic Procedure for CKPO and CMPO

Oscilloscope Channel Setup:

• Select Oscilloscope Tools and then Oscilloscope from the IDS toolbox.

• Connect the VMM to the vehicle and the computer to the VMM as shown in the hookup.

• Connect the red probe to the C1 on the VMM and then into pin 19, and the black probe to C2 on the VMM and then into pin 20 of the middle PCM connector (1381c), (175c for E-Series). (You can leave the connector unplugged from the PCM and just probe into the connector. The engine will still crank). Use the IDS probe kit for cranking signals or the IDS Universal probes (T-015) can be used for running engine signals leaving c1381c connected.

• Select channel one Auto, then CKPO-Diesel 6.0L (or Manual, Red Probe, 5 volts/div, 20ms/div for an engine that will start.

• Select channel two Auto, then CMPO-Diesel 6.0L (or Manual, Black Probe, 5 volts/div, 20ms/div for an engine that will start) or 100ms/div for an engine that will only crank.

• Turn the key to on with the engine off and select Trigger, Type, One Shot and then select the Red Man to turn the scope on. The Red Man will turn to a Green Running Man with the text “Waiting for trigger” in the status area below the signal display. If One Shot is already running when you key up, One Shot will have to be restarted because an unwanted waveform will be captured from the key state change.

• Open the oscilloscope screen to full and crank or start the engine.

• One shot will capture the waveforms automatically. (Turn One Shot off to view the signals live).

• The red signal is the CKPO and the blue signal is the CMPO. (The signal colors will be orange and red when using channels one and two)

Note: Focus on the relationship between CKPO and CMPO. Both CKPO and CMPO signals could be present and valid, but the FICMSYNC could still read NO. If the signals are out of time with each other, check to see if the crankshaft tone ring has slipped on the crank and also to see if the camshaft pin or gear has loosened on the camshaft. Those are the most likely causes for the FICMSYNC signal to be out of time. See screen shot below for proper relationship.

Note: All four signals can be viewed at the same time using all four ports on the VMM but to simplify the explanation of the hookup instructions, ports 1 and 2 (red and black probe) are discussed in this write-up. If using all four channels, you would need to use the ignition probes for the VMM and set the channel to A, B, C, or D depending on which probe you use.

DVOM Diagnostic Procedure (Only if an oscilloscope is not available)

Note: Only use this procedure if an oscilloscope is not available. The data can be a lot harder to interpret using a DVOM.

Cranks NO Start: SYNC=No and/or FICM SYC=No

NOTE: Before starting the following diagnostics, remove the driver side battery and cover up the positive battery cable head to prevent arcing.

Procedure for SYNC=NO with no, low or erratic RPM (possible p2617)

• Disconnect the center connector from the PCM (1381c), (176c for E-Series)

• Set the DVOM to frequency to take a HZ reading, can also set it to A/C volts.

• A valid HZ reading is 150 to 190HZ and be steady. The A/C voltage should be at least .6 volts and steady as well.

• If there are no, low, or erratic readings then check the CKP sensor and wiring per pinpoint test D8. If there is a valid reading then go to the next procedure below.

Procedure for SYNC=NO with RPM (possible p2614)

• Disconnect the center connector from the PCM (1381c), (176c for E-Series).

• To check the CMP signal, hook up a DVOM to pins 31 and 43 of the 1381c or 176c connector.

• Set the DVOM to frequency to take a HZ reading. You can also set it to A/C volts.

• A valid HZ reading is around 1.1 to 1.6 HZ. If checking A/C volts, the voltage will fluctuate and it should go over 1 volt as it fluctuates.

• If there is no or a low reading, check the CMP sensor and wiring per pinpoint test V4. If the sensor and circuit check out, remove the sensor and inspect the end for signs of the cam pin striking it. If it is damaged then the cam pin has backed out and struck the sensor and the camshaft needs to be replaced.

• If the cam and crank sensors and circuits all check out or have been replaced and still SYNC=No, replace the PCM and retest.

NOTE: The readings on the DVOM from the CMP will fluctuate a lot, because there is only one timing peg that comes around for every two engine revolutions.

Procedure for SYNC = YES and FICM SYNC = NO

Note: If SNYC=YES, it only means that there is good cam and crank signals to the PCM. If there is a wire issue between the PCM and FICM or if the signals are out of time, the FICM SYNC will be NO or may intermittently jump from YES to NO.

• The center connector of the PCM will have to be connected.

• While cranking the engine over, make sure that the FICM V and FICM L powers are above 10.5 volts and the FICM M power is around 48 volts at all times.

• The pins 19 and 20 of the center PCM connector 1381c or 176c will have to be back probed.

• Pin 19 is the CKPO circuit. To check it, set the DVOM to HZ and connect it from the pin 19 to ground. The HZ signal should match the CKP reading of around 150-190 HZ.

• Pin 20 is the CMPO circuit. To check it, set the DVOM to HZ and connect it from the pin 20 to ground. The HZ signal should match the CMP reading of around 1.1 to 1.6.

• If there are incorrect readings at either pin, run through the SYNC tests above for the appropriate output sensor (CKP or CMP) before replacing the PCM.

• If there are correct readings at both pins at the PCM connector, pins 5 and 10 of the FICM connector 1388c will have to be back probed.

• Pin 5 is the CKPO circuit (150-190 HZ) and pin 10 is the CMPO circuit (1.1-1.6HZ). Repeat the steps listed above. All readings should be the same at the PCM and the FICM connectors.

• If there are no or low readings at the FICM connector, there is a wire problem between the PCM and the FICM. If there is a valid HZ reading at both CMPO and CKPO pins into the FICM, check all powers/grounds at the FICM and if good, try a known good FICM and retest.

NOTE: Mechanical timing issues can only be diagnosed after all of the above diagnostics have been performed. If all of the above diagnostics have been performed and there is still a FICM SYNC issue, then there is a mechanical timing concern. The two parts of the engine that can cause timing issues are the crankshaft tone wheel and/or the crank gear.

• If the vehicle is a crank no start and has timing concerns with the tone wheel, then usually the scan tool will not complete a relative compression test with a SYNC error.

• If the vehicle starts and runs rough the FICM SYNC concerns go to the power balance function and click on the enhanced button (has a # symbol on it). If the engine smoothes out, there is a tone wheel concern.

• If the vehicle will start only off of an alternative fuel source (silicone spray) and then runs fine, there is likely a cam gear concern.

NOTE: The tone wheel is located in the crankcase and is pressed onto the crankshaft. Therefore, to inspect it for looseness or damage, the oil pan will need to be removed. If the tone wheel is damaged or loose, the crankshaft needs to be replaced.

• Before starting the following diagnostics, remove the driver side battery and cover up the positive battery cable lead to prevent arcing.

Procedure for SYNC = no WITH NO rpm (possible p2617)

• Disconnect the center connector from the PCM (1381c), (186c for E-series).

• To check the CKP signal, hook up a DVOM to pins 30 (CKP+) and 41 (CKP-) of the 1381c or 176c connector.

• Set the DVOM to frequency to take a HZ reading or set the DVOM to Vac and look at AC volts.

• A valid HZ reading will be around 600 HZ and will fluctuate higher and lower. The AC voltage should be around 3 volts and will also fluctuate.

• If there are no readings then check the CKP sensor and wiring per pinpoint test D8. If there is a valid reading then go the next procedure below.

• Reference the 6.01 oscilloscope setup document.

Procedure for SYNC = NO with RPM (possible p2614)

• Disconnect the center connector from the PCM (1381c), (176c for E-Series).

• To check the CMO signal, hook up a DVOM to pins 31 and 43 of the 1381c or 176c connector.

• Set the DVOM to frequency to take a HZ reading, can also set it to A/C volts.

• A valid HZ reading is around 1.1 to 1.6 HZ. The A/C voltage will fluctuate and it should go over 1 volt as it fluctuates.

• If there is no reading, then check the CMP sensor and wiring per pinpoint test V4. If the sensor and circuit check out, remove the sensor and inspect the end for signs of the cam pin striking it. If it has, then the cam pin has backed out and the camshaft needs to be replaced.

• If the cam and crank sensors and circuits all check out and still no sync, replace the PCM and retest.

• The signal is best checked with the oscilloscope. Reference the 6.01 o-scope setup document.

Note: The readings on the DVOM from the CMP will fluctuate a lot, because there is only one timing peg that comes around for every two engine revolutions.

Procedure for SYNC = YES and FICMSYNCE = NO

Note: If SNYC=YES, it only means that there is a good cam and crank signal to the PCM. If there is a wire issue between the PCM and FICM or if the signals are out of time, the FICM SYNC will be NO or may intermittently jump fro YES to NO.

• The center connector of the PCM will have to be connected.

• While cranking, make sure that the FICM_V and FICM_L powers are above 10.5 volts and the FICM_M power is around 48 volts at all times.

• The pins 19 and 20 of the center PCM connector 1381c or 176c will have to be back probed.

• Pin 19 is the CKPO circuit. To check it, set the DVOM to HZ and connect it from the pin 19 to ground. The HZ signal should match the CKP reading of around 150-190 HZ.

• Pin 20 is the CMPO circuit. To check it, set the DVOM to HZ and connect it from the pin 20 to ground. The HZ signal should match the CMP reading of around 1.1 to 1.6.

• If there are incorrect readings at either pin, run through the SYNC tests above for the appropriate output sensor (CKP or CMO) before replacing the PCM.

• If there are correct readings at both pins at the PCM connector, pins 5 and 10 of the FICM connector 1388c will have to be back probed.

• Pin 5 is the CKPO circuit and pin 10 in CMPO circuit. Repeat the steps listed above. All readings should be the same at the PCM and the FICM connectors.

• If there are not readings at the FICM connector, there is a wire problem. If there is a valid HZ reading at both CMPO and CKPO pins into the FICM, replace the FICM.

Good Luck!

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GregKneupper · November 11, 2008

Ok, I think that this thing is going to need a pcm. After more investigation and replacing the cam and cranks sensors and the harness the ficm sync stayed yes. But the truck now runs worse than before. I do not know why sync now stays yes but I am losing communication with the tcm at times. It started and ran fine until it got hot, then it would start to drop out. I reran codes and got a p0500, p1000, and pass tcm. I went and drove it and it was cutting out, shifting erraticly and would not accelerate past 5 mph. Shut it off and it would not restart. The starter was engaging then disengaging. There was no communication to tcm. Reran codes and got a p1000 in the pcm and a tcm fail error. Tried datalogger on tcm and no communication. Waited a few minutes and truck started right up but still cut out. I now had communication to tcm. Brought it back in the shop and it still ran like crap. Shut it back off and it would not restart again. Same scenario. After a while it would start back up. Reran codes again and had a p0606 in the pcm and a tcm pass code. Have inspected harness down to trans and see nothing wrong anywhere. Obviously it is losing communication between the pcm and the tcm so it is shutting engine down. So I now have a pcm on order for this thing and it should take care of it.

DieselD · November 19, 2008

check the center connector to the pcm. the pins get loose in there and can cause lose of snyc. make damn sure that wheel is solid on that crank. I had one do all kinds of weird crap. ended up pulling the sensor and sticking a screw driver in there to try and pry on the wheel to see how secure it was. found out it wasnt and ended up replacing the crank

Jim Warman · November 20, 2008

Just a thought.... how many of you guys are seeing left side batteries without the plastic cover? Enquiring minds want to know....

mchan68 · November 20, 2008

Just a thought.... how many of you guys are seeing left side batteries without the plastic cover? Enquiring minds want to know....

LOTS, where indy shops have replaced batteries.........or other stores where the servicing tech replaced the battery obviously didn't think it was necessary.

GregKneupper · November 21, 2008

after rechecking everything and all connectors a pcm ended up fixing it. It was a very strange problem and I have never seen this before. As for the missing battery covers I see quite a few that are missing.

Jim Warman · November 21, 2008

Not many replies to the battery cover.... Looking at the cover, is there anything that makes it required? Is there anything that makes it expendable?

Keith Browning · November 21, 2008

Ohh! OooH! OooH Mr. Warman! I have seen a few too. None that had any concerns at the time though. I went as far as to provide a part number and price, but none of the customers wanted to replace them.

mchan68 · November 21, 2008

Not many replies to the battery cover.... Looking at the cover, is there anything that makes it required? Is there anything that makes it expendable?

You mean the top portion of the cover that's supposed to protect the PCM and the three bulkhead connectors from being exposed to the elements?

Shlep · February 7, 2009

Just a quick note to keep this alive, I just had an E-450 that I woulda swore needed a harness but after reading this I decided to test the harness with the oscilloscope and found my harness and sensors were right on the money.... not a bad test to do but read it closely a few times to make sure you follow the steps in the right order or the results will really send you on a goose chase Posted Image