Fredsvt Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 Sorry if this is in the wrong place. But I wanted to get an idea of what a Ford dealer tech would get for the following on a CP job. I wanted to see if my boss was in the ball park. I just finished up the following on a 2002 F350 7.3 dual alt truck. Not a work truck a very clean (except for underbody rust) personal truck. Oil pan replacement. Cab on. I did pull the trans/xfer to make pulling/installing the motor easier. Only adds about 25 minutes anyway. While out, I ended up replacing the following rotted/bad parts. Both leaking up pipes (frozen bolts in the manifolds) Replaced both high pressure p/s hoses. Replaced supply and return fuel lines on engine. (ones next to front cover) Replaced both "quick connect" lines that go from the stainless lines to the feed lines on the engine as they were permanent connects. Replaced the t-stat and upper neck. (rotted) Pulled turbo pedestal to reseal. At customer request, replaced both rotted front shocks, engine belt, fuel filter, and 2 batteries as well. Approximate time I spent on it was 12-13 hours. sorry for being so long...tia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Amacker Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 Hey Fred, wandered in from the HDF, eh? That job would be worth at least 18 hours at my shop. Later! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 In my shop the oil pan replacement alone is at least 18 hours. I recall (may be wrong) that Chilton time is about that. All the extra stuff is add-on. Being in NJ we always prep the customer for extra time for seized and broken bolts that may require drilling or extracting. You know the deal being my neighbor - many of these trucks now have significant rust on them. I recently eyeballed a 2004 6.0L with the pan bolt heads 3/4 rusted. They are not coming out with a socket or a wrench I can tell you that is for sure. Actually, now that I think about it, I don't know how I would get them out! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/scratchhead.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamageINC Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 The way I deal with these oil pan jobs is that I basically tell the customer that we'll be looking at just over $3,000 out the door, give or take a couple hundo. That gets me 22 hours of labor, and I tell him that anything that needs to be addressed while the engine is out, will be fixed. (Rotted lines, oil leaks, so on) This also inclueds new front and rear crank seals, a thorough cleaning, and all that good stuff. If something EXPENSIVE is needed, then I'll let him know before doing anything. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredsvt Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 Hey Fred, wandered in from the HDF, eh? That job would be worth at least 18 hours at my shop. Later! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif Hi Bruce, Yes, been around here a while, since I don't work at a Ford dealership, I don't post much. I don't get to see them until they're old and rusty. It's funny, this particular truck only from the A pillar forward was rotted, every line, bolt and hard part was crusty. From the A pillar rearward it looked brand new as does the body and interior. My boss charged him 18. He originally told him 20. I guess he took a couple of hours off when the parts count went way over a grand. The guy didn't seem to care, just fix it. The Ford store we get our parts from told us they'd get 24.5. Another question, since I'm asking. I got leery of Ford's "new" gray silicone for the oil pans, as it doesn't seem to be the same as the Int'l T442. When did it change? We call and get tubes from International. This is one job I care not to do twice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Amacker Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 [quote name=Fredsvt Another question' date=' since I'm asking. I got leery of Ford's "new" gray silicone for the oil pans, as it doesn't seem to be the same as the Int'l T442. When did it change? We call and get tubes from International. This is one job I care not to do twice.[/quote] I have a horror story about that Ford silicone in the short caulking gun tube. We used it to put a pan on a PSD, and it never set up, causing a leak. Upon further inspection, I had bought 3 tubes- the one we used did not have an expiration date sticker on it, but the other two did, and they were way past date. I surmised that someone saw the past date and removed the sticker to make it saleable. We were the poor turkeys that used it. I did get the Ford dealer to reimburse me for labor on that R&R, but it took nearly a year and making my account go nice and high without payment to do it. I don't know when it changed, but I do like the IH gray stuff... /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larche Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 If memory serves correct, does it not say on those 1/2 tubes not for use on 7.3 oil pans? I am sure I was passed one of those recently by our parts department and I questioned it's use for what I was doing, an oil pan on a 7.3. Parts guy said silicone is silicone. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif well I noticed an expired expiry date first, then went on to read the label, not for use on 7.3 oil pans. Having more experience with International than Ford at this point, I recall sending several oil pan jobs to a local International dealer, each of which required to do them at least twice and these were in easier to do International chassis, not Ford. I have used Fords TA 29 several times since being with Ford and have have had no problems. I think the most important is to not have any oil running on mating surfaces. Back in the 6.9 days, I did many oil pans in E series vans. Used what ever silicone was in the gun at the time. I did not have any comebacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Back in the 6.9 days, I did many oil pans in E series vans. Used what ever silicone was in the gun at the time. I did not have any comebacks. You need to use the specified sealant for use in HEUI engines like the 7.3L DIT and the 6.0L because any other silicone will affect the anti-foaming additives in the oil very quickly. In HEUI engines this causes driveability issues. The old IDI engines like the 6.9L and 7.3L (non-Power Stroke) and the 6.4L this is not an issue. I assume this is given knowledge but depending on your experience you may not be aware or remember that there are special requirements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Clayton Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Another little known fact is the silicone is supposed to be allowed to cure for a full 24 hours before starting the engine. This again prevents problems with the anit foam characteristics. If you have a handy dandy bottle of anit foam additive (the stuff thats in the oil to begin with) then you can add a smidge to the crankcase (a little goes along way) and start it and drive right away. Of course not many people have access to the additive in it's pure form and most people including myself aint gonna wait a full day to pull the truck out of their bay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredsvt Posted November 24, 2008 Author Share Posted November 24, 2008 I'm a little more OCD when it comes to the cure time. I leave the engine upside down for 24 hours on the stand after installing the pan to keep any oil off the silicone/pan area. During that time I do whatever else needs doing while it cures. Then after my back recovers during that time I get to go back and hurt all over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larche Posted December 1, 2008 Share Posted December 1, 2008 I did not know that, or like you mention, I may have forgoten if I did know. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherH Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 As far as the labor time, 24.5 hours would not be out of the question with the add-on items that you listed and taking into account the rust factor--at least for our dealership. As for the silicone for the oil pan, the Motorcraft half-tube part # is TA-31 for the proper sealant. I have used this as well as the International stuff and as long as both surfaces are clean and free of oil and proper set-up time is allowed, I have had good luck with these. Now if only someone could find an easy way to dis-assemble the stuff once it is set up! I honestly think you could remove the oil pan bolts from a 7.3 after the sealer has fully cured and it would never fall off!! I remember a few questions from our warranty clerk about M time to remove the oil pan from the block (without bending it to the point of ruining it) and cleaning away all the old silicone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredsvt Posted December 9, 2008 Author Share Posted December 9, 2008 I know what you mean about how strong this sealant is, I had to pry up the pan and cut all the way around the stretched silicone with a razor blade. It's some pretty strong stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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