Stupid, stupid rookie question.

[BLittle500]

Hey guys, don't pick to hard please, if you read my intro you know I just started working on the diesel's and I have a quick question.

 

I got my first "real" job on a 6.0 today. '07 E-350 6.0L, no start when warm. Did the basic testing, pulled codes, came up with a code, but I forget what it was. Followed the TSB for it (only had 300PSI ICP when tested warm), I got everything set up for the air leak test but I did this towards the end of the day and didnt go any further because of not knowing. Now comes the stupid question. When I have the air going into the system, I hear air rushing around, then when I ramp up the IPR the sound changed a little but not much at all. What noise would a HP oil system with no leaks sound with the IPR at 92% (or what ever the max is) sound? Should it be quiet? Does this sound more like an IPR problem to you guys?

 

I just dont know guys, lack of experience here.

 

Thanks in advance,

 

Brandon

[Mekanik]

The noise should basically stop when you close the IPR all the way. I think your on the right track. Do you know where in the engine the noise is coming from? Left bank, right bank? I think that if the noise changes when manipulating the IPR, it is probably OK, but follow the tsb. Also to simulate a warm engine, plug in the block heater.

[Shlep]

Good point on plugging in the block heater, I'll have to remember that one

 

I find a set of engine ears with the end pulled off works well to pinpoint which side is leaking, either in the oil filler or the crankcase breather holes in the valve covers.

[BLittle500]

When I put the stethoscope up to the back of the valve covers I could hear the air really well in both banks but it was a little louder in the right (not by much, but noticeable). Since it should be quiet with the IPR ramped up, I would imagine that a leak would sound greatly different than the air noise heard before the IPR is ramped up, right?

 

If that's the case, I would say that I am having a problem with my IPR.

 

Thanks for the info so far guys,

 

Brandon

[Tony302600]

Can you hear it the most on the High Pressure Pump Cover? or by the valve covers?

 

Depending on the size of the HP leak, when you command the IPR you should hear a slight audible pith change. On E-series, i've had WAY MORE IPR's with holes in them causing low ICP then actual leaks. Don't forget if you arent using IDS and are hooking up the IPR to the battery, not to leave it hooked up for longer then 2minutes otherwise you will damage it.

 

And no question is stupid unless it's one that's never asked.

[BLittle500]

Tony,

 

I heard it with the stethoscope at each valve cover. I really didn't hear much, if anything by the High Pressure Oil Pump. Could the air just be pumping back through the crank case?

 

The IPR's you had with the hole, is this something I could visually inspect for, or is it some where I cant see?

 

I used the IDS to run up the duty cycle, it would only let me go to like 92% (or around there). It said in the TSB about the 2 minutes so I made sure to follow that.

 

Thanks again for the input, and helping a rookie along the way,

 

Brandon

[Aaron]

Haul the IPR out of the HPOP cover. The end of the screen will likely be blown out, or broken right off.

 

I like listening right at the turbo drain tube to determine if the STC fitting is leaking, after the IPR has been changed.

 

The dummy plugs in the oil rails are kinda hard to hear leaks at, I like to yank the rocker covers off and if you hear it leaking bad near the first injector, wheel the dummy plug outta there and inspect the D-rings on the dummy plugs. I just had one of these bite me in the ass a couple weeks ago.

[BLittle500]

Ok guys,

 

I put an IPR in it this morning, and when I ramp up the IPR duty cycle, still nothing changes. I already have the valve covers off of this pig, but the more I listen to it, the more I think its the STC fitting. I wouldnt have thought they would have problems with the STC fittings on the '07s. Oh well,I'll keep digging.

 

Thanks for all of the advice so far guys,

 

Brandon

[BLittle500]

Finally,

 

Just like Aaron said, both dummy plugs had messed up D rings. I wheeled the test plugs in and now I only have a little bit of air passing at the pump, which is apparently normal.

 

Thanks again guys,

 

Brandon

[mchan68]

Finally,

 

Just like Aaron said, both dummy plugs had messed up D rings. I wheeled the test plugs in and now I only have a little bit of air passing at the pump, which is apparently normal.

 

Thanks again guys,

 

Brandon

I find that to be common on '06 and up model years. I've never encountered that on 2005 model years yet. Did you do the STC update?

[Keith Browning]

Good job Brandon.

Sometimes it is necessary to access all of the injectors and inspect every seal - that means pulling all of the plugs on the oil rails as well. If you are going hunting, it is wise to check everything.

[BLittle500]

Thanks again guys,

 

I have all the stuff coming for tomorrow morning. I have the STC update coming, the updated turbo drain tube, and some D rings to replace the ones I used up today.

 

Took this pic with my phone, kind of hard to see the front one though. The far one the D ring is completely torn, the front one had the D ring kind of rolled under:

 

I checked back over everything, especially when I have went this far in an E-Series, I dont want to go back for a while LOL.

 

Thanks again guys,

 

Brandon

[Aaron]

Wow, those dummy plugs don't look at all familiar

 

Looks like there was a little guy in there chewin' on 'em.

[Tony302600]

Guy's watch out for the dummy plug's causing a Lack of power ONLY WHEN the truck is towing a big load, or overloaded. I know a lot of guy's that don't use the ICPDES P.I.D., that's helped me out a lot.

 

I had a 06 F-550 that only lacked power when fully loaded, found both front dummy plug's "on their way" to failing. It started fine hot, cold everything. At W.O.T. fully loaded ICP DES was at 3500 and ICP very slowly declining.

[Bruce Amacker]

I know a lot of guy's that don't use the ICPDES P.I.D., that's helped me out a lot.

Right, and in the IH system, it won't set a DTC unless ICP tops out in the 1800PSI range.

 

[BLittle500]

Just out of curiosity, how long does it take most of you guys to pull valve covers and test and Econoline? I did it by the book, and this thing is taking for ever to come apart/test/and put back together.

 

Thanks again for all the tips guys,

 

Brandon

[Shlep]

Depends on what flavor of E-van you have.... ones we see are always the hacked up buider type with all kinds of crap in the way. I've never actually had a regular van to see what it normally takes.

[Aaron]

Depends on what flavor of E-van you have.... ones we see are always the hacked up buider type with all kinds of crap in the way. I've never actually had a regular van to see what it normally takes.

 

It's funny cause it's true. I think I've only ever worked on one regular E-van for something like this...most of em, like he said, are bastardized pieces of shit.

[Keith Browning]

Just out of curiosity, how long does it take most of you guys to pull valve covers and test and Econoline? I did it by the book, and this thing is taking for ever to come apart/test/and put back together.

Today I pulled in a 2006 E-Bus I diagnosed that #6 injector is blowing combustion gasses into the fuel system. Took me a GOOD 2 hours just to get the left valve cover off. The middle bolts on the bottom are difficult for me due to my Pop-Eye forearms... and this is the easy side!

[Brad Clayton]

I actually find it easier and quicker to get the passenger valve cover off, due to having more room once the motor mount is out.

 

The mount comes out very easily and is actually pretty tech friendly in my opinion.