The 6.7L Scorpion Forum Is Open

[Keith Browning]

Alrightie! I am done teasing you guys. This forum is officially open. I have learned that we will be seeing this engine before the end of this year in 2010 model F-Series trucks along with urea injection. This is not official information but it comes from an excellent source. I may also move related topics from other forums over... so don't get upset thinking you posts were deleted!!!

[OHNO60]

oiiveyyy, urea. Heard the same thing from the cummins rep. Only problem i see is how do you get customers in for the urea refill, when they wont even come in for the 200 hour oil and filter? Anybody have any pictures of this engine yet?

[Bruce Amacker]

how do you get customers in for the urea refill, when they wont even come in for the 200 hour oil and filter?

DEF tank goes low- ECM derates 25%. Tank goes empty, ECM limits road speed to 5mph.

 

Gotcha!

 

[Brad Clayton]

I wonder if the aftermarket will figure out a way to get around that?

[Aaron]

Guys'll just fill the fuckin' thing with water...

[LARRY BRUDZYNSKI]

I drink Crown and Blue, instant Urea Refill. High quality stuff.

[jimmy57]

No urea in tank = no radio and no A/C That would get a trip to the dealer!!

[Cetane]

Guys'll just fill the fuckin' thing with water...

The system monitors NOx efficiency. You cant just fill it with whatever you want.

[Keith Browning]

The system monitors NOx efficiency. You cant just fill it with whatever you want.

I'll take that as a hint this thing has NOx sensors?

[OHNO60]

hahaha nice idea jimmy!

[Cetane]

That kind of information is what your upcoming comprehensive training program is for

[Shlep]

Any other hints an what we might find in this new beast

[Aaron]

Originally Posted By: Aaron

Guys'll just fill the fuckin' thing with water...

The system monitors NOx efficiency. You cant just fill it with whatever you want.

I didn't say it'd WORK, I was just saying what's likely going to happen, if the only indication of the system being low is a warning lamp being on - LOL.

 

[DwayneGorniak]

Yeah, but you just know that some drunken Oil Patch Tard or the lower scum of the Redneck society (drunk as well) is just gonna try pissin in it to see just what happens. I can just see it now: The light bulb comes on and then the drunken scientific talk will start. Some jack ass will yell out UREA!, PISS IN IT! Alcohol and scientific thoughts are just gonna be bad all around. I think I'll be wearing rubber gloves around these units.

[Cetane]

I am not familiar with exactly how the system will respond to "other" fluids being introduced into the system. I am more curious how it will handle some moron filling it up with gasoline or diesel fuel.

[Shlep]

I am not familiar with exactly how the system will respond to "other" fluids being introduced into the system. I am more curious how it will handle some moron filling it up with gasoline or diesel fuel.

Yeah. that ought to be interesting

[Keith Browning]

Maybe we will get another flamethrower video out of it!

[LARRY BRUDZYNSKI]

Looks like this company will be suppling some of the larger OEM's Detroit,Cummins.

 

http://www.eberspaecher.com/menu/1004088_l2/index.html

[gasgasman]

People can't even get their oil changed.

What will make them fill the urine tank?

[LARRY BRUDZYNSKI]

Oh boy...(SARCASM) I can't wait until the A/M finds a Urea delete system to fuck with us some more......With what I have read on the SCR's is that it gives the OEM's a out and able to build really dirty diesel's relying on the aftertreatments to clean up their mess...

Anyone else see this????

[Cetane]

That is absolutely not the case with us. The heavy truck industry might be able to get away with it but we cant. The standards are just too tight to chance slipping a bunch of NOx.

[Jim Warman]

I can't see anyone intetntionally building a "dirty" diesel and then depending on after-treatments to make them acceptable...

 

I don't think that the SCR will spell the end of the DPF and it is here that a "dirty" engine is going to be found out... "dirty" as in particualte, anyway.

 

However, I think I can foresee fuel curves that might be a little more agressive in terms of NOx production... but that is going to be seen when the time comes...

 

EGR technology is based on reducing combustion chamber temps to prevent NOx formation... and this reduces volumetric efficiency and (I believe) increases brake specific fuel consumption.

 

SCR technology appears to allow the formation of NOx and now it can be dealt with downstream. I can see where this might regain some power and mileage lost to EGR technology...

[Cetane]

Guys,

 

SCR and DPF are technologies that were developed to combat two different things. Equipping a truck with an SCR does not mean the vehicle will not have a DPF(or EGR). The problem with Jim's statement is that it assumes that the system is always very efficient. That is not the case, the system has to be at operating temp for NOx conversion to be at the point where the it can provide enough conversion to pass the emission tests. While this happens fairly quickly on the standard emission tests, we dont build vehicles that are only clean in that narrow operating range. If you have somebody that only drives in stop-and-go traffic, it will never be warm enough to work well. On the opposite side, if you are consistently towing a very heavy trailer you may be over the optimum conversion efficiency window. In those cases you will need alot of EGR and other tricks to get low tailpipe emissions.

 

Dont be fooled, everybody's next gen diesels are going to run EGR and lots of it. Not only are the emissions standards extremely tough to meet, but you also want to provide your customers with very low urea consumption.

[Jim Warman]

Ass/u/me... Guilty as charged...

 

I had 'assumed' that SCR would be a replacement for EGR -

 

Thanks, C

[Cetane]

Jim,

 

I wasnt picking on you. I have seen similar comments on this and other forums. Just trying to give you guys a heads up.