low base oil pressure. 04 6.0

[DieselD]

only at idle. 6-7psi until your raise the rpms then will build 45-50psi.

 

customer just changed engine oil and filter. ford filter used. standtube and drainback are not broke. pressure regulator looks good. Im thinking gerotor/front cover issues. however no past repairs that i can see. truck as 150k miles

 

Am I on track here? Ive typically only get the all or nothing low pressure issues. this one being a CP job makes it a slippery slope to start taking parts off to diag.

[mchan68]

Any previous repairs on this vehicle?

[LARRY BRUDZYNSKI]

Are you checking it with a manual gauge or using the gauge on the dash????

[DieselD]

manual gauge of course(thats how I have actual psi readings). however the dash does follow my readings.

 

no repairs that Im aware of. this was my concern as well if it had a stc failure or injector causing debris in the gerotor. Im waiting on a call back from the customer for more info. when its started(the oil has just been changed wondering what the grade is) and if its had any past repairs at another shop since nothing is in our system or oasis.

 

Im also waiting til it cools to see if temp affects it

[GregKneupper]

There is a ball in the side of the high pressure oil pump that likes to fall out on those early model pumps. It is on the low pressure side of the oil pump and causes the oil pressure to fall low when it falls out. Only repair I know of is to replace the pump. If you remove the cover the ball is located on the rh side of the pump when looking at it in the engine. There will be a hole where the ball should be.

[Bruce Amacker]

Are you checking it with a manual gauge or using the gauge on the dash????

There's a gauge on the dash? You don't mean the oil pressure light with a needle on it, do you?

 

Originally Posted By: GregKneupper

There is a ball in the side of the high pressure oil pump that likes to fall out on those early model pumps.

True, these balls do fall out, but it's a no-start when it happens. He's looking for low pressure, and I'd guess the Gerotor pump is the problem.

 

What's the complaint? Is the "gauge" falling down at an idle? You do know it is hooked to an on-off switch and the needle has only two positions, zero and in the middle, right?

 

 

Good Luck!

 

[DieselD]

thats what I thought would happen if that ball fell out too bruce. this is an early 04 has which has the 03 style pump.

 

the complant is oil pressure guage falls to 0 and check guage light comes on when at idle. once driving guage reads normal again or if engine rpms are increased. I do know its a on off switch and has no bearing on what actual pressure is. This is why I have verifyed low base pressure by installing my manual guage(first step I did) and getting a 6-7psi reading at idle and 45psi at high idle.

[LARRY BRUDZYNSKI]

Did the customer have this concern before the oil change or did it occur after???

[DieselD]

Did the customer have this concern before the oil change or did it occur after???

That was my first question and Ill be damned if I can get a straight answer from my advisor or the customer...from the sounds of it it was after. they assure me they used 15w40 but your guess is as good as mine.

 

so I cold started it this morning. 15psi idle and 55-60psi high idle.

[Bruce Amacker]

I'd take a chance and pull the pump. Check the gap between the teeth with a feeler gauge, a new pump is .003-.004", usually they measure .012" or more when they're worn. One guy I helped last week had one that measured about .018".

 

Good Luck!

 

[DieselD]

looks like I have approval to tear it apart and check the pump. Ill keep you guys updated what i find.

[Bruce Amacker]

I already uploaded this picture, but I don't know what the post was. It might have been 7.3 related.

 

 

Good Luck!

 

[GregKneupper]

Bruce, these trucks will run with the ball missing from the pump. Every one I have done ran just fine, the only problem was low oil pressure at idle and a very hard start.

[Bruce Amacker]

Bruce, these trucks will run with the ball missing from the pump. Every one I have done ran just fine, the only problem was low oil pressure at idle and a very hard start.

Wow, that's news to me!

 

Thanks!

 

[DieselD]

Bruce, these trucks will run with the ball missing from the pump. Every one I have done ran just fine, the only problem was low oil pressure at idle and a very hard start.

is this the same on both styles of pumps? 03-04 then 05+?

 

I am having a hard start when cold too but its not too bad, dont think its related to oil pressure but.....

[Bruce Amacker]

 

is this the same on both styles of pumps? 03-04 then 05+?

 

I just checked my pictures and there is no ball plug on the late style pump.

 

 

Good Luck!

 

[GregKneupper]

The ball falling out only happens on the early model pumps. Not the ones that have the stc fitting. If you do not find an issue with the low pressure oil pump I would pull the pump cover and check for that ball.

[DieselD]

pump measures .005" no damage to speak of on the gear or cover. some scratches on the cover but cant really catch a nail. dont think this is my issue.

 

next on the list is pulling the cover to the hpop

[kridd12]

Dwayne had one a while back that kept having low base oil pressure. it was a early 04 as well I think, but the issue with that was there was carbon chunks the size of pancakes floating around in the oil pan. Weirdest thing I have ever seen. Cleaned out the pan and rechecked under the oil cooler for the screen and it was ripped apart from all the carbon going throug it. There are some pics somewhere on the photopost of these pancakes. Ended up replacing the pump and cover as well as cleaning the pan out and fixed the issue.

[kridd12]

AHHH... sad but I had to get grampy jim to show me how to post photos...I feel shame

[DieselD]

so cover pulled and that ball is still in its home....

 

Im running out of options and of course this has to be a customer pay job.....

[blown99]

Check the oil pressure relief? I've had a few that had debris stick the valve. Had a few others where the debris scored up the pump housing causing the low oil pressure.

[Aaron]

Check my find the standpipe thread, that motor had low oil pressure, also

[DieselD]

Check the oil pressure relief? I've had a few that had debris stick the valve. Had a few others where the debris scored up the pump housing causing the low oil pressure.

 

checked that already since Ive had that problem as well. no dice there either

 

Originally Posted By: Aaron

Check my find the standpipe thread, that motor had low oil pressure, also

 

been down that road more than I can count, this truck still has its standpipe.

[2006]

-I would do a high pressure air leak test first to make sure that the high pressure side is not leaking.

 

-Oil pressure relief valve possibly sticking

 

-If you have the high pressure oil cover off, you can try and remove the oil sending unit and apply about 40 psi of shop air into that port and listen for a air leak, similar to a high pressure air test. There will be some air loss through the piston cooling jets.

 

-Make sure you have the right oil filter on it. Oil could be dumping back through the drain valve.

 

-You can remove the oil cooler and test the oil pressure in the vertical oil gallery from the oil pump and checking the pressure there. This can test the oil pump, strainer and relief valve. You should have a lot of pressure even when cranking.