Tony302600 Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 I heard at the dealership i left, this year, there is no raises, they are in a mini-audit ( i was waiting for that to happen ), no one is getting extra vacation/sick days and the owner said if anyone mentions the union in the service area he is shutting down the dealership. I was told by the senior master that i got out at the perfect time. I can't believe one of the biggest arguments about bailing out GM/chrysler is to keep american jobs. Obama needs to figure out how to turn us back into a production country and not a consumer based economic system. Now, if/when those jobs get sent out of the country, now you have even more people un-employed, so who is gonna have the money to buy stuff, and their cars. Someone thats not working isnt going to go out and buy a new car. MAybe they may even boycott them for doing it. NOT ONE PERSON has said anything about the UAW driving the work out of the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DwayneGorniak Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 When the economy goes in the dump and we have a recession like this, consumers generally quit buying new products. But the trend is that they repair what they have because they can't afford to replace it. It takes a while for this to happen beacause we have to wait for all those newer cars to get a little old. Things just don't happen overnight either. The Recession sucks, Plain and simple. But I try to focuss on what I have control over rather than what I don't. I know I stray a little from that with topics like this, but hey, I try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted June 10, 2009 Author Share Posted June 10, 2009 But I try to focus on what I have control over rather than what I don't. I know I stray a little from that with topics like this, but hey, I try. But Dwayne, I think that (what I quoted) is EXACTLY what Jim was was trying to point out and that is what this topic is about or at least what I was hoping it would be. There are a lot of reasons and components to the situation we find ourselves in. But it all starts with the individual. Don't like your situation? Do something to make it better or make a change. Focusing on things "you" do have control over - like bettering yourself, doing things to the best of your ability, making the effort to do and be your best every day - will all have an influence and an impact on the people around you, your career, the business you work for and if enough people think this way, the industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekanik Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 How many dealerships are closing? How many "techs" are being turned out into the wild? How many of these guys are willing to work for peanuts? How many are better than "me".... Good point. There is a dealer not that far from us that got really fed up with it's service dept that it fired every single person in the working in service. They figured with all the techs, service writers, parts guys, service managers out looking for work, that he could just start over with a whole new crew. I have a feeling that many techs that get laid off will eventually find something different to do. (I at least hope that they find something different to do) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DwayneGorniak Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 Sometimes my wording isn't all that great and sounds a little fifferent that what I meant. I was more or less getting at the point about the fact that some folks really beat themselves up about this Onion and Big three topic. I do like to stir the pot a little at times in case no-one has ever noticed. But I don't think we should all lose any sleep over it. Life is a bitch sometimes and sometimes and a Bitch Sometimes does our life some good. But, once we've beat the bejejus out of this topic, I'll start another topic under this "SPEAK UP" post that has been brewing in my corrupt mind for quite some time. because it's sometimes fun to bitch. I may have just confused myself with this theory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted June 10, 2009 Author Share Posted June 10, 2009 I think the effects of that hood accident are becoming evident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 +1 I think Dwayne needs some medicine sometimes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blown99 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 I think most of the problem is in the people themselves. It all goes back to the fat lazy american. Starting all the way back in the late 60's. As the quality of life improved, kids started getting handouts from their parents instead of working for things. This turned into a giant snowball and got worse with each generation. Everybody is quick to pass the blame, why not, it is easier than accepting your failure. Right now as a nation we blame the gov. both past and present, blame the unions, auto makers etc. But do the american workers sit back and think for a minute why we have no industry, a recesion and no jobs? Every year the working american wants more paid days off, a pay raise, pay less for their healthcare. Does that worker work harder? Go to various websites during your working day and see how many people are viewing forums, shopping on ebay, watching you tube videos. IMO it is all BS. They drove up the cost to their employer to employ their lazy ass. The companies see a less expensive way to make money oversees in china. After all, is that not why a business is in business?, to make money right?People should be paid flat rate, just like us techs. Get paid for what you do, not for being a body in a building. The faster and harder you work, the more money you make. I have several people that I work with that feel they should be given special rights because they have been with the comapny for 20 yrs. They feel they should not have to work all day, a younger guy should do the bull work, they stand around and talk about how the company is f'ing them in the A all time. I've worked for many shops and this attitude is everywhere. WTF, do your job, do it well, get paid, and go home proud that you worked an honest days pay, knowing that you worked the entire day the best you can. I don't think the average american worker can say this at the end of the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekanik Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 Originally Posted By: Jim Warman The automotive industry is in a great state of flux.... Now is the time for those that feel the need for change in the system to speak up. Jim put this worm in the water in a different topic... I feel the concept deserves to be explored. I'm all ears. You, gentelmen, are all members of a venue willing to put the intellegent voice of professionals out there. Anyone care to bite this worm? My only real bitch is the way we get paid. These cars now have some really high tech systems. I'm a senior master and I keep up with all of the web based training, but I cannot be an expert on every single system on a vehicle. I don't think its right that I only get paid for roughly half an hour if I'm lucky to diagnoss most problems(under warranty) with the exception of diesels and some drivabil. Especially when I'm dealing with some really expensive parts, I need to be thourough and make sure it is going to fix the complaint. I'm also really big on concentrating my energy on things that I can control. I think everyone here probably agrees with me on this but seriously, what can we do about it. Like Jim said, there are plenty of techs out there that have been out of work for a while and are ready to probably work for a little less. There is too much supply on techs and not enough demand right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony302600 Posted June 11, 2009 Share Posted June 11, 2009 How many times in your shops have you heard, "well, it's not MY job to do that." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastendpowerstroke Posted June 12, 2009 Share Posted June 12, 2009 IT'S NOT MY JOB! Every time I hear that I think of this clasic.. http://www.gambino.com/funstuff/notmyjob.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Originally Posted By: DwayneGorniak So what are we gonna nickname the North American three now? The Big Kahuna and the two sponges? lol. Obama Motors! It makes me sick to see how the Jap carmakers have come over here and showed us how to build cars "right" when we are the birthplace of the automobile. I think the majority of their plants are non-union and they make a reasonable wage for the work they do. IIRC, Japs pay about $38/hr vs. UAW average of $70 something an hour (which is an inflated figure that includes retiree obligations). Most Americans drool at the thought of making $38/hr! Cleveland is a huge automotive town with a Ford casting plant, Ford engine plant, Chevy stamping plant, Chevy driveline plant, and Chrysler stamping plant, all within 20 minutes drive of my house. This excludes the Ford assembly plants that closed nearby in Avon and Lorain, and the huge GM assembly plant in Lordstown, both less than an hour's drive from my house. The local news channel recently showed the closed Avon Ford plant being used as a storage facility for thousands of unsold Hondas. What a bizarre sight that was! The thing that pisses me off the worst about the UAW is how many UAW workers I know that FUCKING BRAG about how little work they do! Quote#1 from the Chevy neighbor across the street: "I run out of newspapers to read at work all day." Quote#2 from NUMEROUS Ford workers at the Brook Park Engine Plant: "I work on a team of 4-8 guys. Many times I go to work and punch in, and then go home and sit by the phone (on the clock!). My teammates will call me if something comes up and I need to get in." I've seen their paystubs sitting in their cars when they come in the shop for repair. These guys are making over A HUNDRED GRAND A YEAR for this "work". They deserve to starve and die, and the US automotive industry WILL dwindle to nothing if the unions are allowed to continue in their present form. These guys actually SMIRK when they inadvertently talk about how much they make. It's like they hit the lottery! They cry like little babies when they lose their jobs because they don't have a true trade or marketable skill once they fall off the gravytrain. Even their layoff pay (which is 95% of their clock pay) is a fucking crime. The severance packages are also a joke to most of us. This has been a problem for decades that doesn't seem to end. I REFUSE to subsidize these lazy SOB's that refuse to work. Yes, I drive a Jap label car, made in Indiana by non-union labor. It's a Goddamn shame it had to happen. Between the unions and the US engineers/beancounters with their heads up their collective asses, I just can't bring myself to buy a car I don't have faith in. 25 years of running an independent repair shop showed me the weak points of the US automakers: intake gaskets, fuel pumps, power racks, head gaskets, trannies, etc. the list goes on and on. We have the ability to be the best vehicle on the planet for only pennies more per car, and they WON'T do it. I just don't understand. This is obviously a huge thorn in my ass and a huge pet peeve for me. I know I'm speaking to the Ford world here, and I ask you to forgive me for driving what I drive. I do have faith that the US automakers will come back, but I just don't know how they're going to break the backs of the unions to do it. The gov't won't help them break the unions as it is political suicide to do even think of this, much less do it. It has to be through bankruptcy or attrition somehow. Larry, you're in the heart of it all. Do you see these same problems in Detroit? http://laborrightsblog.typepad.com/inter...the-us-too.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekanik Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 Originally Posted By: Bruce Amacker Originally Posted By: DwayneGorniak So what are we gonna nickname the North American three now? The Big Kahuna and the two sponges? lol. Obama Motors! It makes me sick to see how the Jap carmakers have come over here and showed us how to build cars "right" when we are the birthplace of the automobile. I think the majority of their plants are non-union and they make a reasonable wage for the work they do. IIRC, Japs pay about $38/hr vs. UAW average of $70 something an hour (which is an inflated figure that includes retiree obligations). Most Americans drool at the thought of making $38/hr! Cleveland is a huge automotive town with a Ford casting plant, Ford engine plant, Chevy stamping plant, Chevy driveline plant, and Chrysler stamping plant, all within 20 minutes drive of my house. This excludes the Ford assembly plants that closed nearby in Avon and Lorain, and the huge GM assembly plant in Lordstown, both less than an hour's drive from my house. The local news channel recently showed the closed Avon Ford plant being used as a storage facility for thousands of unsold Hondas. What a bizarre sight that was! The thing that pisses me off the worst about the UAW is how many UAW workers I know that FUCKING BRAG about how little work they do! Quote#1 from the Chevy neighbor across the street: "I run out of newspapers to read at work all day." Quote#2 from NUMEROUS Ford workers at the Brook Park Engine Plant: "I work on a team of 4-8 guys. Many times I go to work and punch in, and then go home and sit by the phone (on the clock!). My teammates will call me if something comes up and I need to get in." I've seen their paystubs sitting in their cars when they come in the shop for repair. These guys are making over A HUNDRED GRAND A YEAR for this "work". They deserve to starve and die, and the US automotive industry WILL dwindle to nothing if the unions are allowed to continue in their present form. These guys actually SMIRK when they inadvertently talk about how much they make. It's like they hit the lottery! They cry like little babies when they lose their jobs because they don't have a true trade or marketable skill once they fall off the gravytrain. Even their layoff pay (which is 95% of their clock pay) is a fucking crime. The severance packages are also a joke to most of us. This has been a problem for decades that doesn't seem to end. I REFUSE to subsidize these lazy SOB's that refuse to work. Yes, I drive a Jap label car, made in Indiana by non-union labor. It's a Goddamn shame it had to happen. Between the unions and the US engineers/beancounters with their heads up their collective asses, I just can't bring myself to buy a car I don't have faith in. 25 years of running an independent repair shop showed me the weak points of the US automakers: intake gaskets, fuel pumps, power racks, head gaskets, trannies, etc. the list goes on and on. We have the ability to be the best vehicle on the planet for only pennies more per car, and they WON'T do it. I just don't understand. This is obviously a huge thorn in my ass and a huge pet peeve for me. I know I'm speaking to the Ford world here, and I ask you to forgive me for driving what I drive. I do have faith that the US automakers will come back, but I just don't know how they're going to break the backs of the unions to do it. The gov't won't help them break the unions as it is political suicide to do even think of this, much less do it. It has to be through bankruptcy or attrition somehow. Larry, you're in the heart of it all. Do you see these same problems in Detroit? http://laborrightsblog.typepad.com/inter...the-us-too.html Good article!! I totally agree. How come the people in our country who are in charge of failing banks are paid so much compared to the Japaneese bankers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredsvt Posted June 13, 2009 Share Posted June 13, 2009 That was a good article. But then we should also apply this to our "public servants". How about cut their salaries in half. Make them PAY for their medical benefits like the rest of us. Cut their pensions, as they get full pay until they die, which is then transferred to their spouses, and when the spouses pass, it goes to any children. And they get free for life medical. How about put them on medicare like my mom is. Eliminate our "public servants" from more than 1 job in gov't which pads their pockets, raises their pensions and fucks us all in more taxes. I think the revolt is coming, and it's not going to be pretty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted June 14, 2009 Share Posted June 14, 2009 That was a good article. But then we should also apply this to our "public servants". How about cut their salaries in half. Make them PAY for their medical benefits like the rest of us. Cut their pensions, as they get full pay until they die, which is then transferred to their spouses, and when the spouses pass, it goes to any children. And they get free for life medical. How about put them on medicare like my mom is. Eliminate our "public servants" from more than 1 job in gov't which pads their pockets, raises their pensions and fucks us all in more taxes. I think the revolt is coming, and it's not going to be pretty. Please, don't even get me started on them!!! Just curious. What do the rest of you guys think, every time you drive by a bunch of picketers waving placards "HANDS OFF MY PENSION" or other such similarly asinine slogans, obstructing traffic? Do any of YOU ever feel the need to show support to these idiots? I know I don't!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted June 14, 2009 Share Posted June 14, 2009 I used to drop the hammer on the ol' GM diesel and leave 'em standing there in a big ass cloud of soot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshbuys Posted June 16, 2009 Share Posted June 16, 2009 One thing I know to be a fact. Whenever a republican is president... his sole purpose is to fill the pockets of his friends and people who contributed to his campaign. So far in President Obama's 137 days, he's had to clean up all of Bush's f-up's. Mending all the relationship's he's fucked... the stupid policies, crazy uneeded spending. I'm happy at the job he's doing, and pissed that a good amount of people are still bitching about him. SERIOUSLY?!?! Maybe you missed the part where Obama spent more money in his first 100 days in office than all the 43 prior presidents COMBINED!!!! How can that possibly be good for our economy?!?! AND HE'S NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING DONE!!!! Talk about "crazy uneeded spending"!!!! Government involvement in any business is BAD FOR THE ECONOMY! The bailout of banks and automakers is no exception to this rule! Government CANNOT fix the recession....all these bailouts are doing is POSTPONING the inevitable and WASTING TAX PAYER MONEY....YOUR MONEY....MY MONEY....AND NOW MY GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GRANDCHILDRENS MONEY....Where will it end?!?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted June 16, 2009 Share Posted June 16, 2009 Not to be inciteful (but failing miserably), I think it fair to comment that it wasn't the president (Obama or anyone else) that got the auto industry into the shit that it's in.... How much did Wagoner get simply to fade away? What percentage of the MSRP of a midsized automobile went to pay for employee (assembly line) benefits? You are correct, at most levels, the government should not be involved in private business.... But... would you prefer that all these thousands of auto workers become welfare or unemployment recipients? Or is it more appropriate that they remain employed and useful? Do we simply close the doors on assembly plants and suppliers smug in the knowledge that if we do not act properly now, we may join t6hese people in the line at the soup kitchen? One of the major concerns to plague the western world for many years has been the overwhelming desire for government intervention.... except that when they are forced into the game, we bitch about them being there. Thye government - yours - mine - whoevers - can throw all the money in the world at a problem.... But if we don't all stand up and do our part to help, if we are going to leave both the government and these companies just hang without doing our part to turn the economy around, we may just as well flush the toilet now.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Amacker Posted June 16, 2009 Share Posted June 16, 2009 I have found it wise not to discuss politics among friends..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony302600 Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 Originally Posted By: Tony302600 One thing I know to be a fact. Whenever a republican is president... his sole purpose is to fill the pockets of his friends and people who contributed to his campaign. So far in President Obama's 137 days, he's had to clean up all of Bush's f-up's. Mending all the relationship's he's fucked... the stupid policies, crazy uneeded spending. I'm happy at the job he's doing, and pissed that a good amount of people are still bitching about him. SERIOUSLY?!?! Maybe you missed the part where Obama spent more money in his first 100 days in office than all the 43 prior presidents COMBINED!!!! How can that possibly be good for our economy?!?! AND HE'S NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING DONE!!!! Talk about "crazy uneeded spending"!!!! Government involvement in any business is BAD FOR THE ECONOMY! The bailout of banks and automakers is no exception to this rule! Government CANNOT fix the recession....all these bailouts are doing is POSTPONING the inevitable and WASTING TAX PAYER MONEY....YOUR MONEY....MY MONEY....AND NOW MY GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GRANDCHILDRENS MONEY....Where will it end?!?! This is not the place to talk about this because keith already mentioned to stick to the topic. I went off topic and spewed my thoughts that everyone doesnt agree with. But you are forgetting what happened in the great depression when the gorvernment didnt do anything.....that was the worst thing they couldve done....NOTHING.....Obama's "UN NEEDED SPENDING," did you fall asleep the past 8 years? ALl the top economist's are saying Obama is doing exactly what is needed to get this country moving again. I honestly don't know how this will all pan out. Deep down i feel that if the unions don't agree to some "reasonable" agreement, all the jobs that would have been lost if GM and Chrysler failed, will still be lost when those companies ship the jobs overseas to save money. The only thing you guys at the dealership can do, is do what's right and remember that the customer is paying your paycheck. Shitty work will only come back to haunt you. I'm glad Ford is doing well, and they are putting out car's people want. How bout the 2010 taurus....i think that is going to be a hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 No more politics....Good call.... We need to look at the big picture, Toyota has jumped in first with built in America commercials bragging about having 10 plants in the USA building cars sold in the US by US citizens for US citizens and not having sent work out of the country. All I keep seeing is jobs going elsewhere to save money to bring more profit and pay high-priced blow dick exec's a bigger bonus for doing it. Chrysler just announced today its restarting a plant, wanna guess which one????Take a look and see if it makes any sense.... http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/19760284/detail.html No sense to me????? Guess where I'm from???? Yep Detroit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STROKER_T Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I love reading what u guys put in a subject like this,I've been reading it to my wife,she is LOVIN' it! I actually enjoy working on trucks,have been for a seemingly short 15 years,i could'nt even come close to putting it any betterthan what Kieth,Bruce and Tony have put it! My wife drives an 08 Hyundia Sante Fe,seems to be a great little crossover,I drive a GMC truck,go figure.. This website is the shiz-nit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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