modifications and warranty

[sixturbosix]

I had a guy bring a 05 f350 dually in today due to loss of coolant,rough running,and smoking heavily.Pulled it in bay and first thing I noticed was pillar guages,banks sixgun programmer,exhuast work all the way back,and k&n stickers all over it.Did visual checks blowing coolant out like a fire hose from degas bottle.Pulled egr valve and it was shinny as new from extreme coolant saturation and intake was also full of coolant.Would not hold 15" of vacuum at degas for even 30 seconds before it hit almost 0"We are just entering a warranty audit on diesels. I really haven't had a warranty diesel with mods in a while so I thought I would do things correctly.I haven't even torn it down and done an egr cooler off vehicle test yet and told prior approval this in the request form because I was going to list the modifications when I requested prior approval and new it would probably be denied and a waste of time.Requeted prior approval and listed all modifications.Within 10 minutes I had an answer.Baised on information provided by dealer you are approved for egr cooler replacment.WTF! I could have sworn that all the Ford memos I read a while back said no power adders or warranty denied.I call hot line just to reasure myself I won't get a kicked back claim because this thing may go to headgaskets before its over.Hotline says they appreciate my concern and honesty but they will cover the repair even it it is headgaskets.They said the only two things right now they can deny warranty on with a power adder is headgaskets with no egr cooler failure and internal engine failure.Maybee I didn't read the memos that were sent out very well.NOT!!!

[Aaron]

2 things I got from the Ford stuff.

 

1. They have to prove, beyond a shadow of a doubt that the aftermarket component caused the failure. if there's any window of doubt that can be cast on the failure - I don't think ford wants to deny it and risk the customer taking them to court, which brings me to...

 

2. I was told by several different people that when faced with the possibility of legal action, when it comes to a warranty repair - Ford will just lay down and take it because the cost of the repair will likely be less than the cost of court, lawyers, etc.

[sixturbosix]

But from what I gather they don't mind trying to get the dealerships to tell customers that they are responsible for the repair if they have modifications hoping some may just pay the bill and go on.But if it goes to Ford's playing field they would rather just pay the claim instead of paying to fight a losing battle.Another interesting thing hotline mentioned was that if the truck ended up in another dealership later and that dealer did not report the modifications that they now have on record they would send an inspector out to see if the mods were still there and if they were they would question that dealer about them.It seems they know they can take money from the dealer alot easier then they can the customer.They are the puppet masters and we are the puppets.

[Keith Browning]

Remember, it is easier to prove neglect than abuse. You have a great case when an engine has an inch of sludge under the valve covers. Then try to prove those modifications caused the EGR cooler to fail... particularly when they are failing in serious numbers.

 

I had a conversation with my FSE this evening about the recent TSB on maintenance specifically oil changes and coolant testing. It will never be used to deny warranty. It WILL help to (re)educate the customers and hopefully more trucks will receive the proper maintenance. In theory, this should help reduce failures thus warranty costs. As far as mods go, there is little they can do to stop them much less prove they caused or even influenced a particular failure. Unless you can prove so with 100% certainty, I personally wouldn't waste my time documenting it.

[sixturbosix]

Thanks for the input on this subject matter.It has helped me understand more how Ford is viewing situations like these and handling them.

[joshbuys]

Just gonna throw this in the mix from my experience. We had 2 separate trucks that were highly modified (one 6.0, one 6.4. Edge programmers, Exhaust, Intake, etc. Both with blowed up engines. The 6.0 got covered under warranty with 50+k miles after inspector took pictures of everything and submitted his findings. The 6.4 was denied warranty with less than 7k miles. My SM filed a CUDL and contacted ford to give them heads up on customer calling. Inspector took pictures and submitted his findings, customer called ford raising hell, ford said sorry but no warranty. Our ford rep told us that because we filed the CUDL there were now 6-10 people to answer to in warrantying such a repair where without filing CUDL there's only 1 or 2 that know what's going on. Perhaps might work the same with blown coolers/headgaskets with mods?!?!

[sixturbosix]

We replaced an engine in a 6.4l with no modifications almost 3 moths ago due to hydrolock and bent rod.This engine actually split #8 cylinder from top to bottom.By looks of the amount of build up in the turbo inlet and the oil level on the dipstick extremely high it had alot (and I mean alot) of fuel in the oil that probably caused it.Customer had service records to prove oil was changed regular.Ford gave prior approval for a complete engine and suggested replacement of the DPF.After engine replacement prior approval was obtained for a DPF replacement.Now RO has been under review for almost 3 months because we replaced the DPF that Ford suggested and approved.Makes you wander how much communication is going on up there or if they just want to hold that money as long as they can before giving it up during these hard times.