VCM going to be discontinued?

[Fredsvt]

I've been looking at both the IDS and Honda's HDS, which both use the GNA600 (VCM) made by Teradyne.

 

If you try and get a GNA600 for an HDS they say that it's not available and there's no ETA. I haven't tried Rotunda for the IDS yet..

 

I found out that Honda is possibly going to a subscription only type scan tool that uses a J2534 interface.

 

Has anyone heard if the IDS is going that route, at least for the aftermarket?

[Keith Browning]

I would think that the VCM will be around for some time. BUT, I took a poll on the PTS website last fall that questioned our use of the VCM ans the VMM. There were questions/statements that eluded to giving me the impression that the next scan tool is in fact in development and that it may combine the functions of the VCM with the VCM in one interface tool... at least that is the strong impression i got from it. I couldn't tell ya what they are working on. PDS is at the end or near the end of it's life as far as support is concerned.

[DwayneGorniak]

When I was in school a couple of months back our instructor told us that the VCM will only be supported till 2012. At that point in time Ford will be getting out of the Diagnostic tool business and creating only diagnostic software such as the IDS being that it has been so successful. He said we will be going to a generic interface that we will be able to acquire form local tool dealers and that it will be allot simpler to deal with.

[ktmlew]

When I was in school a couple of months back our instructor told us that the VCM will only be supported till 2012. At that point in time Ford will be getting out of the Diagnostic tool business and creating only diagnostic software such as the IDS being that it has been so successful. He said we will be going to a generic interface that we will be able to acquire form local tool dealers and that it will be allot simpler to deal with.

Which means the dealership will not be required to provide them. Just like with what used to be special service tools...now if Snap On or another tool manufacturer makes a tool, the tech HAS to buy it or do without...

[Fredsvt]

So, the question becomes, if they go to the J2534 interface, similar to the Mongoose cable setup that works with Toyota's Techstream software, how much will Ford be charging per subscription to use it?

 

It looks also like you'll need a different mongoose cable per whatever brand you work on.

 

The Toyota software is around $1100 per year to "lease", you download it, but it stops working and you have to pay and stay connected to the internet to keep it going.

[Keith Browning]

And for that price I would not even consider the purchase. As it id IDS is tough to swallow. AS for dealers not buying it I don't see how they can get away with not buying it.

[DwayneGorniak]

Most dealers don't even care. Because most of them are flat rate. Therefore if a tech has to wait for a scan tool they see it as the tech losing money not them. But they don't seem to see that an efficient tech makes for an efficient dealership paycheck through the labour charged out. Which goes back to my theory about most dealerships: "Minimal Investment and Maximum Profit" or "Get The Tech To Invest And Reap The Profits". Seems more and more like the trend these days.

[GregKneupper]

I hope that the ids does not go away. I own one my self and have invested quite a bit of money in it. I will be very dissapointed if I have to purchase another scan tool. Our shop only has 1 ids for 27 guys. I had to have my own in order to be productive. I also would not like to tell my wife that I would have to spend another 3 grand on a scan tool.

[DwayneGorniak]

IDS is not supposed to be going away. Only the VCM is going away after 2012. The software for IDS is what Ford will keep manufacturing seeing as it has been extremely successful and makes total sense. There are benefits to this system. If Ford only makes software for scan tools, we will be able to purchase our own laptops as many of us are already doing at better prices than what we would get through I-connector or Ford. If the generic adapters are available through tool dealers, eventually they will compete and the prices should eventually come down......I hope. But all in all, I think it will be a good system. They will most likely just have their certain requirements for the sytem to work as they already do.

[Jim Warman]

Generic shit is going to be cheap... this is the "emissions critical" stuff... the stuff that EPA and inspection stations look for.

 

How many states in the US do a dyno/sniff test? With the systems we have now, I firmly believe that it wont be long until we have a visual/code scan test and we are done...

 

Where the coin is going to get spent is on proprietary type stuff.... Active commands... I can't think of any aftermarket tools that feature active commands (other than injector buzz test). Active commands is an underused feature as far as I can see... but now, with some of the new technology we are seeing (especially in terms of lighting systems), that may change. Using a DMM correctly and accessing active commands is going to be a valuable skill in the time to come.

 

The VMM... well, it's kinda good but not so good. Certainly it is better than the cartoon we got with the WDS but it is still "run, Gumby, run".... I'm not sure I like the conversion algorithms (seems like some info can "get lost" easily) and it isn't as user friendly as it pretends to be (or am I just that stupid ). If you want a scope, I think something like Bruces Pico might be a far better choice... it will lack dependancy on the IDS, it appears to give a better representation of volts/time or amps/time... it may lack some user friendliness but it is time we understood some of this stuff a little better, anyway... Bruce?

 

From where I sit (I don't have a steady diet of diesels and that puts me at a disadvantage for some stuff) I see that information technology is changing... Traditionally, the PCM has been the "gateway" module... To communicate with any other modules, we would first need to establish comm with the PCM... Today, it appears that the APIM is the new kid on the block.. Today - we see that we are dealing with two networks... HSCAN and MSCAN.. and the APIM is one of very few modules that is "bilingual". I don't know why they do stuff the way they do... this is reason enough for concern.

 

I expect that one of the reasons that the VCM will expire is because we are going to experience yet another change in baud rate. My first computer connection to the outside world was using Super Kermit at 9200 baud... That would be 1992ish.. I can remember being amazed at my first 28.8 modem. I spent too much time "being amazed".. I am now permanently jaded.

 

If Ford only makes software for scan tools, you can bet your sweet ass that you will either choose a "supported" device or suffer any consequences.. real or imagined...

 

Did I forget? Any changes to software... be it diagnostic (did anyone say "interactive diagnosis"?) - be it measurement or intuitive - you can bet your boots that the goal is going to be to "dumb down" the skills and knowledge required.

 

One of these days, you... me.... anyone reading this... we will all become "redundant". In the movie 2001, the computer HAL9000 said " I think you know what the problem is just as well as I do.". In the next generation scan tool... is this a possible response?

 

We want more money... Ford wants to spend less.... with the right software... what might happen?

 

Moral of the story... I wasn't with Ford for the STAR or the SuperStar or StarII... I do occasionally use some of the older tools even though I would prefer not to. I've used the NGS and the NGS+ a lot... and the WDS and the PDS and the IDS... My Monitor2000 was "the last scan tool I would ever need" as was the 4000 and the 4000E and the MT2500.

 

As a human being (aka "meat thing")... once I have entered this world, the only thing I MUST do is die.. Everything in between is optional. If I were a scan tool... my greatest accomplishment would be patiently waiting to become obsolete. And that WILL happen.

 

Technology happens... HERE is a link to a simple computer. I have been dragged, kicking and screaming, from the dark ages.... You youngsters only ever see the next generation of computers as "better game graphics".

 

Step one.... learn your history...

 

Step two.... learn FROM your history.

 

At best, I have ten years or so left in me. You guys have the rest of your lives... it is important that you come to grips with your career... your future... and where your future may carry you.

 

HoHum... Windoze 7.... How I pine for the days of MS-DOS 3.whatever. Are you shaping your environment? Or is your environment shaping you?