Bruce Amacker Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Hey Guys: I'm writing a new class about the top ten things technicians do wrong in the shop. The problem is, I've already got 14 things on the list. I'd like to hear your experiences- what are the top ten things you see guys in your shop doing wrong? I'm not talking shop safety here, more on a technical level regarding diag and wrenching. You can post just one thing or as many pet peeves as you like, and I won't put mine up until later. Being that this is Friday and Grampa likes to get lubricated, I'm looking forward to a nice healthy list..... Any takers? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregKneupper Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 My biggest pet peeve is people just throwing parts on cars or trucks with no diag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff_E Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Open circuit voltage testing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 [*]Grandpa gets lubricated [*]People who don't read instructions [*]People who don't follow instructions [*]Technicians not using the proper safety gear as required [*]Technicians not using exhaust hoses while running vehicles in the shop [*]Failure to use a "backer wrench" when tightening critical fittings or when removing cooling stator bolts [*]Leaving shop manuals and tools out on oil filled work benches [*]Leaving parts removed from customer vehicles on the floor - ESPECIALLY engine parts [*]Not capping fuel system fittings [*]Not capping induction system openings (CAC tubes, intake openings, turbo inlet etc.) while working on engines in chassis [*]Improperly "probing" electrical connectors & damaging them [*]Not flushing transmission coolers after a failure [*]Standing on front bumpers scratching the paint or chrome [*]Not clearing DTC's after repairs [*]Not road testing after repairs [*]I know there are more... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 The difference between "no ohms" (as in no resistance) and "no ohms" (as in an open circuit and no reading on the meter other than 'OL'). Not referring to the heading marked "How To Use This Manual". Manuals are neither intuitive to use nor are they well written. They are written by technical writers - not by trained techs. And we segue into.... Manuals are written by technical writers... these days there is a LOT of CUT and PASTE. And inappropriate PPTs live on... I think it was Jeff said "open circuit voltage testing" in this thread... Add testing grounds with an ohmmeter... When performing PPTs... look at what the test step is trying to accomplish and perform the best test for the task (usually a load test). And we segue into... PROPER voltage drop testing... using active command mode when volt drop testing... Practice with your toys.... SGM... used to be easier with WDS but get used to dragging out VMM. It can save you time and effort. Do you even know what SGM is? OK.. let's get back to "wrong".... Get a great big hammer - and hold the handle real close to the head... ???? If you hold your hammer close to the butt of the handle, the swing will be nearly intuitive... if you focus on the point you are aiming for... Put down your purse and swing that hammer like a man. OASIS... Some "techs" seem to enjoy spending four hours diagnosing a concern only to find out the TSB pays .6.... "Did you check OASIS?" - " I was going to do that after I wasted a bunch of my time and yours...". Broadcast messages... you can treat this like a career - or you can treat it like a job.... Broadcast messages sometimes go "do not attempt a repair at this time... engineering is working on a solution...". I'm sure we all know how to spell "chargeback". Bringing your home to work... I don't care if this is your first job of the day... Use a seat cover and, if necessary, a floormat. I have dogs... I can't see my back.... I wont leave my customers any presents... If you use a seat cover (steering wheel cover, floormat... whatever) nobody can blame you for leaving a trail of bad shit. On the subject... if you are going to adjust the radio, turn it off or down... do not turn it up or change the station. IDS... IDS is one of the most powerful diagnostic tools available for current Ford vehicles... yet many of us treat it like a $39.95 code reader... Oh, wait... did I already say "practice with your toys"? I have way too many competing themes going on in the old skull tonight...not because I'm addle-brained. But because Bruces choice of topics have opened a flood gate. We all suffer from varying degrees of myopia and/or misinformation.... And, sadly, much of what I have to say was learned the hard way... Not learniing from the mistakes of others.... now there's another top ten idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Trying to "long cock" Keith... Replacing a "unit bearing" but leaving the old wheel speed sensor in place rather than running the new harness... If the customer bought the part, they should at least get it... Not road testing??? What do you call "parking it in the back lot"? That don't count? Electrical testing without a battery charger... wonky things happen when battery voltage starts to drop... modules start responding haphazardly... loads function oddly... and now we have power distribution controlled by MOS/FETs and memory shit happening. And what about guys that don't check source voltage before they check other voltages (correctly or incorrectly). Flat rate reading... I have to force myself to slow down... We have the key on or other circuits active for too long in the shop.... We have to boost the truck to start it... we drive it out back and shut it off... The service adviser can deal with the backlash later.... Wearing coveralls improperly... ever see what a zipper pull can do to a fender? The number one, baddest, worstest, most idiotic thing I can think of... and I see it far too often... guys trying to fix something when they have no idea of how it works (the WSM has sections marked "description and operation" ). One I see often is ESOF on SuperDuty. It is important to understand the sequence of events as well as the function of the pulsed vacuum hubs. If you don't know what it does, how can you fix it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 A friend of mine once had a convenience store... I overheard him giving his cook shit one day... "never ever sell anything you wont eat yourself...". Don't do anything to a customers car that you wouldn't want someone else doing to yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Yep. He's lubricated alright! There has to be more guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregH Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Watching the tone of one's voice and the language you use... In our shop, the service write up area shares the same airspace as the work area. Foul language, techcnician outbursts, loud music with rude lyrics, arguments, and other crap float over to the customer's ears and generate a very unprofessional aura. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Amacker Posted March 20, 2010 Author Share Posted March 20, 2010 Here's my draft list. I already put 85 slides in the presentation regarding problems: In no particular order, except the last couple: 10: Failure to properly torque injectors 9: Failure to consult the service manual for procedure 9. Failure to visit internet forums for help 8: Failure to check coolant for additive packages 7. Probing electrical connectors and damaging the terminals 7: Failure to clean battery connections and load test the batteries individually 6: Failure to check cranking RPM with a scan tool on a hard start 6. Not checking TSB’s and update letters from the manufacturer 5: Failure to use the proper IH/Ford diagnostic sheets to their best advantage 4: Failure to understand an electrical voltage drop test 3: Failure to verify clean power to the ECM/FICM/IDM (voltage drop through connectors, relays etc) 2: Not having the proper tools/equipment/scan tool to complete the job properly (this is borderline tech's fault and management's fault. Many times with the aftermarket the tech is the shop owner and wants to shortcut things with the wrong tool (scan tools, especially) 2: Failure to take a fuel sample from the filter in a jar and inspect it for contaminates/quality/water 1. Not checking fuel pressure under load on a low power complaint (there's no fucking excuse for this one besides plain laziness) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Great list Bruce! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Bruene Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 We have a few guys in the light-duty shop that like to replace modules, then diagnose what is really wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mbl35 Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Not using a star pattern when tightening wheels! Not putting tech manuals away and shop tools. Food crumbs on the IDS keyboard, grease on the IDS and leaving the IDS dead! especially Leaving injectors loose and just throwing egr valves in when there's coolant present in the intake manifol-6.0-That falls in the incomplete diagnosis catagory. Oh yea not configuring modules etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Clayton Posted March 21, 2010 Share Posted March 21, 2010 Not checking the oil level after an oil change. I see way too many guys pump it out of the reel and slam the hood. I guess the correct amount made it into the crankcase. And then the're the ones that end up double oringing an oil filter or leaving the oil cap laying around under the hood and sending the car out the door. The basics can be the most difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gasgasman Posted March 21, 2010 Share Posted March 21, 2010 Our lube rack NEVER checks the trans fluid levels after a flush, unless it has a conventional dip stick. We have so many come backs it ain't funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixturbosix Posted March 21, 2010 Share Posted March 21, 2010 One that I don't see is in some situations yes you do need to use a torque wrench.Especially transmission work.I have seen guys who thought they had a built in torque wrench in their arm.The only problem was it only had 2 settings to loose or to tight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshbuys Posted March 21, 2010 Share Posted March 21, 2010 Our lube rack used to only use 'torque-sticks' when installing wheels - and didn't go back and check them with a torque wrench. I asked them several times if the 'torque-sticks' were calibrated to their impact guns, and they looked at me like I was stupid, even mentioned it to the SM a couple times. Then one day, a car came in for an oil change and tire rotate and wouldn't you know.....it made it out of the parking lot and about 200 yards up the road....where the right rear departed from the vehicle! Turns out the lube tech failed to even tighten those lug nuts beyond starting them with his fingers. Needless to say, they are now required to check them with a torque wrench!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted March 24, 2010 Share Posted March 24, 2010 Worse than not checking a fluid level... ticking off the box on the inspection report that says we did (my Mum used to call it lying...). Using anything other than a round wire gauge when checking or adjusting spark plug gap... not checking the gap on new plugs (where applicable). Collapsing brake calipers without opening the bleeder screw. Letting calipers hang by the hose. Not measuring the rotor AFTER machining. Digging into an overheat concern and not checking ALL the layers in the cooling stack for debris. Checking fuses without a fuse box diagram.... we never get to check the ones that aren't there. Not verifying the customer concern... not being able to differentiate between "feature" and "bug". Cleanliness... seat covers, floor mats, door handles, steering wheels... Probably more to come... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrunoWilimek Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 My biggest beefs? 1. Overtightening the oil pan drain plug, thus stripping the threads. I am not Ahnold Schwarzenegger, but a 98lb weakling I am definitely not. I should not have to use a 1/2 inch drive 2 foot long Johnson bar to loosen an oil drain plug. 2. Overtightening the oil filter/not lubing the rubber o-ring before installation. These two faults cause the same result, the oil fiter comes off looking like it was the loser in a demolition derby. I recently removed an oil filter from a 7.3 that had the bevel cut o-ring completely flattened out. I ended up driving my centreing-type pry bar through it and had to turn it several turns, driving the bar completly through the filter each time before it finally was loose enough to spin off by hand. If you want to prove your manhood by tightening stuff, do it on a bridge girder bolt and leave the engine maintenance to someone else. 3. If you use a shop tool or manual, put it back where it belongs when you are done. I am paid flat rate and if I have to spend time looking for something somewhere it is not supposed to be I get very angry. 4. If you use a shop tool and break it, don't just put it back and not tell anyone else it is broken. If I have to use a tool and it is unusable it really gets me angry. Stuff breaks. I get that. Nobody is going to beat the crap out of you for breaking something, and you won't have to pay for a new one, just tell the S.M., or someone. 5. If you made a mess, clean it up, especially in one of the shared bays like the alignment rack. I hate working in a messy work area. I have more, but that should do for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Adema Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 1) Assuming ANYTHING is wrong. Don't assume you know the failure/complaint/problem, don't assume the fuel pressure, don't assume the customer's ability or otherwise to spend money or understand you or the problem, etc. 2) Reusing o-rings/gaskets/seals or using silicone inappropriately, or assembling things dry/lubed inappropriately. I heard once, "Nothing goes together dry or dirty, if you don't learn it from me you'll learn in sex-ed class or the clinic." 3) Not labeling or otherwise keeping organized wiring/vacuum/air lines, just in case someone else takes over (because you're sick/injured/dead) or you're late/stupid in reassembling. My brain is too small to remember everything, so I try to organize. 4) Oily footprints/floor-dry/parts all over the place. 5) Washing hands. Do they charge you for the soap and water where you work? No? Then why are you eating/writing/driving/typing with dirty hands? Do you understand what stereotypes are? 6) Ignoring the obvious. 7) "Closing one eye." Do you know what I mean by that? Letting shit slide by on an inspection because you're in a hurry/customer's waiting impatiently/etc. 8) Talking trash about anybody, anytime. 9) Deflecting the blame when the shit hits the fan. Think you're a man? Admit you're wrong or messed up. 10) Threading something in, like a drainplug, and not tightening it. If it's in, it better be tight. If it's not, it better be out. 11) Bay doors part-way closed. How do you think they get damaged? BTDT, twice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 1) Assuming ANYTHING is wrong. Don't assume you know the failure/complaint/problem, don't assume the fuel pressure, don't assume the customer's ability or otherwise to spend money or understand you or the problem, etc. 2) Reusing o-rings/gaskets/seals or using silicone inappropriately, or assembling things dry/lubed inappropriately. I heard once, "Nothing goes together dry or dirty, if you don't learn it from me you'll learn in sex-ed class or the clinic." 3) Not labeling or otherwise keeping organized wiring/vacuum/air lines, just in case someone else takes over (because you're sick/injured/dead) or you're late/stupid in reassembling. My brain is too small to remember everything, so I try to organize. 4) Oily footprints/floor-dry/parts all over the place. 5) Washing hands. Do they charge you for the soap and water where you work? No? Then why are you eating/writing/driving/typing with dirty hands? Do you understand what stereotypes are? 6) Ignoring the obvious. 7) "Closing one eye." Do you know what I mean by that? Letting shit slide by on an inspection because you're in a hurry/customer's waiting impatiently/etc. 8) Talking trash about anybody, anytime. 9) Deflecting the blame when the shit hits the fan. Think you're a man? Admit you're wrong or messed up. 10) Threading something in, like a drainplug, and not tightening it. If it's in, it better be tight. If it's not, it better be out. 11) Bay doors part-way closed. How do you think they get damaged? BTDT, twice. QUOTED FOR TRUTH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gofaster23 Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 -Not using a torque wrench -Having 3 lines on an RO for the same concern -Tech's not cleaning up their workspace -Not replacing missing nuts/bolts -Cutting/Hacking parts to fit (05 and up HP oil pump cover) -Not performing a full diagnosis, throwing parts on it -Turn a blind eye to lack of maintaince when that is the cause of the concern and the customer is a "buddy of the advisor".(clogged aftermarket fuel filters, factory fit fuel filters on a 6.4L at 65K miles). -Contacting Hotline immediatley to try to find an easy fit without doing diag. -Shop "foreman" that have ASSET students to do all of their work, they don't even show the students how to diag. "Take this turbo off a 6.0L and take it apart". "Why, what am I looking for"? "Because I said so, now do it while I update my Facebook status". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbriggs Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 Quote: -Having 3 lines on an RO for the same concern Also having one line with 3 or more concerns on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 This is looking more like a bitch list! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted March 27, 2010 Share Posted March 27, 2010 This is looking more like a bitch list! And with this comment grasped in my shakey old fist, I can segue into another thread... look for "Staff Meetings". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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