mchan68 Posted July 11, 2010 Share Posted July 11, 2010 Okay, how do I begin this one? Got myself an '06 F-350 2WD dually that darkened my doorstep that overheated, requiring the customer to top the coolant with two full gallons. It wasn't until late Thursday that I was able to get to it and roll it into my bay. After some of the usual testing per 09-08-03 I quickly determined that a set of coolers were needed, so I managed to rip it apart to the point where I could dig into it and finish it Friday. Fast forward to Friday morning when I took the turbo apart and noticed the unison ring damaged, as well as the shaft seal with very obvious oil breaching into the exhaust end of things, confirmed by the excess play in the shaft. Okay, I was just able to get the order in for a CHRA for the afternoon order, so I thought great, I might as well carry on with whatever I can finish up with, until the CHRA arrives. Fast forward to the afternoon when the order was supposed to arrive. Somehow, someone at Ford screwed up because it didn't arrive (and I saw the parts guy putting it in for the order). Okay, just great. So this job isn't going to get paid out because I'm not going to be able to complete it (Friday is the cut-off for the pay period following). I was then informed that it would arrive this morning. Soooooooo, I roll into work this morning (on my unscheduled Saturday to work) to find a box on my bench with part number 5C3Z-9G489-AARM sitting there. I assemble the CHRA and get it all buttoned up, and fired up. This thing runs smooth as any 6.0L will run when I fire it up. I go to road test it. It runs fine until I get to the next corner and it begins to fall flat on its face and turbo fart really loudly to the point where everyone I pass turns their head. The boost gauge pegs out at 25 psi but has ZERO balls. I get this fucking thing back into the shop, minus a left/rear hub cap that fell off during my brief "road test". I now have ODDTCs P0299, P1408 and P2263!!! WTF?!!!! I had no problem assembling CHRA. The cam pivot moved very freely (I vaguely recall a few posts about bad-out-of-box CHRAs). Now the fucking thing is too hot to disassemble, so I won't be able to get back to it until Monday. Just great!!! Sorry for the long sob story. I needed to vent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted July 11, 2010 Share Posted July 11, 2010 MAP hose hooked up? How did the truck drive before? Like shit? CAT plugged? (seein a lot of this lately, worse when hot)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted July 11, 2010 Author Share Posted July 11, 2010 MAP hose hooked up?Yes. That was the first thing I checked. The fact that the boost gauge pegged would confirm this as well. Originally Posted By: Aaron How did the truck drive before? Like shit? CAT plugged? (seein a lot of this lately, worse when hot)...It drove fine, other than the smoke from the tailpipe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted July 11, 2010 Share Posted July 11, 2010 Turbo boost test says what after the concern? What kinda EBP are you seeing? All the CAC tubes are hooked up, and the air filter didn't get soaked with water laying on the floor or something beside the truck, with the wash kid spraying down the next bay? But it is a pickup, so you could have left the parts in the box (Typically box trucks and cube vans get the stuff stacked under my bench or beside the truck, pickups have the shit go in the back) Just thinking out loud here...trying to figure out what the fuck went on. You did let the truck run for 15 minutes or so to oil the turbo? Did you pre-oil the turbo before you put it on? They tell you to let the truck run for some time, 5, 10 or 15 minutes I can't remember now, at idle, to properly oil the turbo. Me, I built a pressure oiler, so I don't fuck with that stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted July 11, 2010 Share Posted July 11, 2010 Did you happen to look and see if the impeller wheel is still on the turbo? (The new one, I mean) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastendpowerstroke Posted July 11, 2010 Share Posted July 11, 2010 We have had a run of cloged cats here as well mostly short bus's , The bus's came in for coolant loss complaints and got what we refer to as "The 6.0 tuneup" (oil/egr coolers, turbo cleaning,oil change and coolant flush). But failed the road test. Try dropping the exhaust and retest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Clayton Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 Quote: MAP hose hooked up? Com'on now Aaron, a person would have to be a real bonehead to overlook something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 Quote: MAP hose hooked up? Com'on now Aaron, a person would have to be a real bonehead to overlook something like that. Oh .... Brad...... you shouldn't have said that... some of the smartest folks have overlooked some of the simplest things... I recall a 6.0 here in Alberta that got (IIRC) two sets of head gaskets (including a pair of heads) and a motor because the radiator had no airflow.... Another 6.0 that wouldn't run after some major work... Hotline got involved and the parts cannon got loaded several times. Eventually, it was fixed and all we ever heard was "It's fixed - go away!!!". Bad things happen to good people - DAMHIKT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregKneupper Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 You definitely need to check all the above stated things first but yes, I have seen several chra's right out of the box that are no good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Clayton Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 That was a reference to an inside joke. I put a turbo on an E-box and knocked the map line off the sensor inadvertantly when I had the wiring harness pulled up from under the cowl. Needless to say it took me a minute or three to figure that out. I was already condeming the turbo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fabfoes87 Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 Quote: MAP hose hooked up? Com'on now Aaron, a person would have to be a real bonehead to overlook something like that. Hahahahha. Real nice Brad. We'll keep that a secret. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 Come on guys were tryin to help out here......Sounds to me like there are other things going on here besides a turbo and coolers. How about the EGR valve? Any chunkies? Seems to me that every time the coolers need to be replaced we also see EGR valves,intakes and turbos being tossed into the repairs. I think you need to be looking deeper.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbriggs Posted July 12, 2010 Share Posted July 12, 2010 I had an excersion come in a few weeks ago, doing the same as what yours is doing now. Text book seized turbe, stuck "small". Yanked the turbo and tore it down. Looked great, everything moves free. Put it back in, same deal, stuck small, makes boost but ebp is so high it wont go. Ended up being the actuator. After carefull inspection i could see it stuck (in the non venting position) causing full oil pressure to act on the piston. I removed it and pushed on the end, the valve sleeve went pop and returned to where it should. Put it back in, fired it up and it was stuck again instantly. New actuator fixed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted July 12, 2010 Author Share Posted July 12, 2010 Status Update: Ripped the downpipe off at the cat. No problems there. The monolith inside appears intact. Pull the turbo out and apart (in record time). No probs there. You CAN'T screw up re-installing the vanes, so no problems there. The cam pivot moves nice and free. Sooooo, back together it goes. This time, I get my apprentice to "toggle" VGT duty cycle with the solenoid out, but plugged in. No probs there. The solenoid seems to respond to commands. Get it up and running. Vehicles drives as smooth as a whistle AGAIN (like it did Saturday), up until full operating temperature is reached, and then the bullshit begins AGAIN!!!! Boost gauge pegs at about 25 psi, but won't get out of its own way, blowing PLUMES of black as I attempt to accelerate and turbo farting very loudly when I release throttle. Okay, so I get it back into the shop. Yank out the IDS and very quickly determine the air management tests fails on the open command. No probs there either. We all know that an EGR system not functioning can cause a 6.0L to fall flat on its face. So, in a new valve goes. Life is good, up until it gets back up to operating temperature, yet AGAIN. Rerun the air management test. This time it passes!!!! This time, with the apprentice riding shotgun with IDS and all PIDs loaded up and waiting for him to hit that magic "record" button (we don't have a VDR in our shop), we go on yet another road test. We must've wasted at least a good hour and a half and 30 kms. repeating SEVERAL WOT throttle acceleration events, and no problems found!!!!! My service manager doesn't have the time of day for me, and this is one of those situations where I don't feel comfortable releasing the vehicle back to the customer. You guys know what's going to happen, right? My manager is just going to tell me to let the customer have back. He's going to take it, and it's going to do it again, and I'm a BAD technician!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 Last one I had EGR troubles with, the intake was all caked up with carbon and shit inside, and intermittently, a piece would blow through the valve, and sometimes would stick there. Would run like shit for a while, maybe, and then clear up. Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshbuys Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 PULL THE MAP HOSE AND RUN A STRAIGHT PICK THROUGH THE ORFICE TO MAKE SURE IT'S GOOD AND CLEAR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted July 13, 2010 Author Share Posted July 13, 2010 Last one I had EGR troubles with, the intake was all caked up with carbon and shit inside, and intermittently, a piece would blow through the valve, and sometimes would stick there. Would run like shit for a while, maybe, and then clear up. Just a thought. Funny you should mention this. I think this particular truck is being used as a grocery getter judging by the amount of carbon I had to clean out of the intake when I had it all apart for the coolers. At this point, I've ruled out the workmanship factor (namely mine), due to the fact that everything came apart easy and went back together without a struggle. The only thing that makes me uncomfortable about closing the RO is due to the fact that I haven't done anything since bringing it back to the shop to grab the IDS and wait for the symptom to reappear. We all know that problems don't just fix themselves, RIGHT? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordtech03 Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 We've been sending the intakes out and getting them hot tanked over night to clean all the gunk out of them when we do a cooler replacement. it is more down time granted, but less of a problem with a comeback. Had a situation happen with a customer that was very similar to yours, piece of carbon would break loose and intermittently foul the EGR valve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordracer Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 I had one a few weeks ago that did the same thing after reaching operating temp. Was getting 25 lbs of boost but the IPR was 84%, ICP 1,000 lbs, and ICP_DES was 3,800. And this truck only had 45,000 miles on it. New HPP and IPR and all is good. I was suprised it could make so much boost with such low ICP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbriggs Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 What was EBP doing when it was happening? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshbuys Posted July 13, 2010 Share Posted July 13, 2010 We obtained an intake that the SM decided needed replacement due to the amount of carbon and the particular customer whose truck it was, and then parts was told to scrap it. So, we've always got a clean intake ready to go on. We have a hot soap/water parts washer Kuda - does a pretty good job getting these clean - each intake gets washed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Meanwrench Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 Seeing alot of this in the ambulance fleet world. My trucks run all day long. I keep 2 clean intakes ready to go. Been burned before with that random piece of carbon breaking off and jamming the EGR open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjubain Posted September 1, 2010 Share Posted September 1, 2010 Mike lately we have seen several bad chra assy,my self i had to replace a second time 3 of them.One had no seal on the turbine side and filled the exhaust in only a few minutes.The others had no boost and failed vvt test.The last one had no boost on first road test but then cleared up and was ok,released vehicle and ame back 200km after,took out turbo and could not nove vanes using the magnet test ,just loosening the band clamp freed up everything found no concern from my part when diassembling, replacing the chra again repaired my concern.I have talked to hotline and agreed to me that they are having issues with the heat threated chra.They are not cleaned properly before heat threated and then lacks clearance between the unison ring and chra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbriggs Posted September 2, 2010 Share Posted September 2, 2010 I've had some heat treated ones with mad rust buildup on them as well, heat treated right in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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