dieseldoc Posted September 17, 2010 Share Posted September 17, 2010 This thread starts with an experience on my personal 06 F-250. I had the seals replace at 20,000 miles because they fell out, I know it doesnt seal anything really but keeps the dust and debris away from the inner axle seal. Now at 45,000 miles I notice when servicing the truck last that the seals have fallen out again. I was intrigued by this and began looking down the fleet at work and other trucks I have worked on in the last couple months and 95% of them the seals have fallen out. Is there a trick you guys have come across to keep these seals in place or should a guy just not worry about it? The years range from the 05' 550 I drive at work up to and 09' 350 one of the other guys drive. Havent looked at any 03 or 04s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted September 17, 2010 Share Posted September 17, 2010 Seals for 05 and up have been redesigned... IIRC for the 04 and earlier trucks they still have the older style. The new seals are mostly metal, fit into the axle tube rather than on to the axle and appear to stand up much better in the mud. I would be concerned if, for some reason we needed to make a significant caster adjustment since this would shift the axle, qite probably, away from centre in the tube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted September 17, 2010 Share Posted September 17, 2010 I have noticed a lot of them over the last couple of years. Customers rarely care about them either. It has been a very long time since I have done a customer pay ball joint/seal job on a Super Duty as well. I have questioned the need for that seal anyway, once upon a time the axle tubes were open to the world with no real problems that I recall. But someone deemed them necessary, designed the truck that way so I suppose there is a good reason for them dependant on what the trucks is exposed to like water or deep mud that might migrate into the axle tubes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted September 17, 2010 Share Posted September 17, 2010 The old part number BRS-123 changes up to a completely redesigned seal part number BRS-170 if it matters. Although I have yet to install one of these completely redesigned seals, it does look much beefier than the rubber ones. If for no other reason, it likely will look much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted September 17, 2010 Share Posted September 17, 2010 Basic number is 1S175, and it is covered under powertrain warranty. And they do seem to hold up quite a bit better than the old style ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted September 17, 2010 Share Posted September 17, 2010 On 07-up trucks, that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseldoc Posted September 19, 2010 Author Share Posted September 19, 2010 I am kind of with you keith my old trucks never had the seals and I have never replaced the seal due to a leak. I have only put two sets of the inner axles seals and that was during overhaul of the axle. I am not to worried about it,just curious if you guys have found a good way to keep them in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted September 19, 2010 Share Posted September 19, 2010 I am not sure what we are talking about here is keeping them in place. They usually separate into two pieces and you get that nice rubber ring that dances on the axle shaft next to the universal joints. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted September 19, 2010 Share Posted September 19, 2010 This is what we are trying to tell you.... for anything current (including Roberts 06) replacing the seals gets rid of that problem. The new seals are redesigned - as in really fucking redesigned. They are installed into the housing rather than on the axle shaft. No more dangling ring after the grit gets at them. You 2WD pansies need to work on REAL trucks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted September 19, 2010 Share Posted September 19, 2010 Installed using the mythical "SUITABLE DRIVER" I have a few construction vehicles I see tear the early style seals out in short order. Hopefully these will show a little more in the longevity department. I know a lot of guys just cut the offending pieces off and keep right back at 'er. I noticed on a 2011 truck today, they have the update-style seals in them already, and the recess in the axle tube looks a little deeper than on the 05-10 axle housing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted September 19, 2010 Share Posted September 19, 2010 As an afterthought, if/when one of those seals ever comes dislodged from the axletube, it should make a delightful whirring/scraping noise if the truck is ever in 4x4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted September 19, 2010 Share Posted September 19, 2010 In 4X4? Around here they crank the hubs clockwise at the first sign of mud. When the NVH issues become too much, we unlock the hubs for them (that's a warranty concern, right?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted September 20, 2010 Share Posted September 20, 2010 Most folks in this area are unaware that the hubs have an AUTO or LOCK position... they stay in whatever mode they are in when the truck gets delivered. Unless, for some reason, that happens to be "LOCK" and there's NVH issues, like you said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Clayton Posted September 21, 2010 Share Posted September 21, 2010 I kinda like the new design 'cause it's robust enough to center the axle as you install it. That way it don't drag all the way down the tube and cram all that junk into the inner seal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted September 22, 2010 Share Posted September 22, 2010 I agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseldoc Posted September 22, 2010 Author Share Posted September 22, 2010 Who can hear anything above the engine at 3400rpm in 4 lo with a 525 hp tractor in front of you pulling you to the broken machine????? You want to talk about diagnostic pressure you have to get the machine fixed or you cant go home because your truck is buried to the frame rails. I am not a fan of abusing a truck like this but you have to do what you got to do. That happened to me twice last fall That looks like a way better seal design. You guys wouldnt happen to have a part number for it by chance, and preferred installation method? I like the theory behind that seal and would like to get something back in there before the mud season really gets here. We had 5" of rain total in the last week and a half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted September 24, 2010 Share Posted September 24, 2010 BRS-170 is the updated seal. The basic number is 1S175. The seal is installed using a suitable tool I use a 3/4" diameter brass drift and to fully seat the seal after I start it using a 4" or so diameter to get the seal started in the bore. Drive the seal in around the outer diameter with the drift until it bottoms out. The seal I believe actually comes with some install instructions in the bag. I use some emery cloth to clean the rust and shit off the axle before I put it back in, and put some grease on the contact surface of the seal itself before it all goes together. Make sure you change the rest of the hub seals and junk too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 I had to do some inner oil seals today and I got a pair of these new dust seals. After searching though my mythical tool drawer the seals went in easily but they don't seem to go far. I spent a bit time sanding the rust off of the axle shafts which is a must otherwise sliding the shafts through the new seals will be near impossible. I am curious as to whether these seals will prevent a leaking oil seal from being detected in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbriggs Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 Quote: I am curious as to whether these seals will prevent a leaking oil seal from being detected in the future. Ya no doubt! The rh tube will probably hold 2 or 3 liters of oil (conveniently topped up every service for 50,000k or so), then one day release in one large oil pukefest. I can see it now..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ford1664 Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 i cannot count how many sets of these i have done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Saunoras Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 The only 2 I've ever done reside on my truck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chase Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 I service a lot of oilfield trucks, I see the BRS-170's hide axleseal leaks and also hold water in the axletubes. One of the most recent ones I did had both tubes and the pumpkin full if milkshaked gear oil. These guys also only get about 7,000 miles out of a set of brakes in a super duty though- they are kind of hard on their trucks.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 I service a lot of oilfield trucks, I see the BRS-170's hide axleseal leaks and also hold water in the axletubes. One of the most recent ones I did had both tubes and the pumpkin full if milkshaked gear oil. These guys also only get about 7,000 miles out of a set of brakes in a super duty though- they are kind of hard on their trucks.... I'm not a real big fan of the new seals, myself. The older seals were more forgiving if you found the need to make a radical caster change to the front alignment. However, we (our area is hard on 4X4s) would often see these seals torn up well within the B to B warranty period. Back when the 4X4s still used the C6TZ- -A spindle bearing, we recommended a "spindle service" about every 30K kilometers. With the switch to the sealed spindle bearing, this recommendation has fallen by the wayside. Now, we need a hub engagement concern or a bearing noise concern before we act. Ford has given us a seal arrangement that is guarranteed to visually make it past any and all warranty periods. Reducing the after sale cost of a unit increases the profit margin on that unit. That brings us to another, little discussed point. Retail (customer pay) work. On several boards (at least the ones I haven't been punted from) I see a constant litany of techs moaning about having no work other than warranty work and having to wait around for that to dribble in. I can't speak for anyone else... but our idea of slow is "we can get you in day after tomorrow". Normal = about two weeks. Retail/warranty ratio is about 40/60. Too many stores operate under the "we have them for the next three years" idea. I work on a few 2011s that have nearly 200,000 kms on them. Did I mention that I'm prone to digressing? 'Nuff sed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted April 9, 2012 Share Posted April 9, 2012 If stuff in your area has 200,000kms on it, how many hours does it have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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