Summit Ford Silverthorne Colorado

Keith Browning · March 17, 2011

I came across this at TDS forums today. What a shame... but I get the feeling there is more to this story so it will be interesting to follow where this goes. This is a good reminder to be and do your best and what can happen when the Fuck-up Fairy exposes you.

Read the comments on Youtube below the video HERE and if you are interested read this topic on TDS forums. Dealer Says I need a new engine

Bruce Amacker · March 18, 2011

Unfortunately, this is a story I have heard many times over from all corners of the country, especially regarding E-vans. Parts left loose or missing, shrouds cut for component access, harnesses damaged and rubbing from gorilla repair, overall butcher work, it's an epidemic. I've had several customers tell me it's cheaper for them to fix the van in-house and eat the cost than to send to to the dealer and have it done for free (after a 2 week sunbath).

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Keith Browning · March 18, 2011

But why do you single out "the dealer" Mr. Amacker? Above video aside, I have had a lot of trucks fall in my lap after a private shop bastardized repairs. It's an INDUSTRY epidemic not to omit what some do-it-yourselfer's are capable of.

Bruce Amacker · March 18, 2011

You are correct and I apologize to everyone on this board, we have talked about this in the past and we all agree it is industry wide and not dealers only. My customers rarely, if ever, send stuff to indys, only dealers, so I hear the horror stories constantly about both Ford and IH dealer service departments.

Indys are just as bad, or worse, than dealers. Some recent posts on a large public well known Fleet Repair forum are perfect examples of that.

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Keith Browning · March 19, 2011

Yeah, that's what I thought you said Mister! Posted Image

Jeff_ · March 19, 2011

I'm wondering why is it, if the owner of that truck is so smart and capable of taking it apart himself, why did he pay a dealership $1700 to fix it for him??? Perhaps he should man up and fix it himself?

Keith Browning · March 19, 2011

Jeff, I think the point is the engine was misdiagnosed and not repaired... along with missing fasteners and a broken dipstick that was not installed properly to begin with.

I want to know how the vehicle was released to the guy running the same way it went in there. I would have at the very least let the customer know the dipstick tube was broken and replaced it upon his approval. At least the fact that is was broken would not have been a surprise if he had declined it.

Another thing to note is that in this day and age your bad work could easily be on display at Youtube.

One more thing. It only takes a few technicians doing work like this to make us ALL look bad.

Jeff_ · March 19, 2011

Yeah, I agree with all of that Keith. Certainly that dealer dropped the ball on the missing bolt and dip stick tube ect. The customer strikes me as a little arrogant and quick to jump to conclusions on his vehicle that has almost a million miles though.

Reminds me of that Seinfeld episode with the soup nazi. If a customer with an attitude like that came in to buy some soup, the guy behind the counter would yell "NO SOUP FOR YOU" and the cashier would simultaneously grab the soup out of his hands and throw his money back in his face. But if he came in humble and polite, he would get some of the best soup in town. I guess what I'm getting at, is maybe he should have went in and talked privately with the service manager about his concerns and at least given the dealer a chance to make it right or explain what more needs to be done without making a public smear job on Youtube.

I read the "Dealer Says I need a new engine" thread, and from what I get out of it, during the replacement of the 3 injectors, the dealer had found the tip had broken off one of them and probably shelled the engine. The customer was told this, but opted to only replace the injector(s) and see how it went. The dealer was wrong when they apparently said it was all fixed, but I'm guessing that could have been a mis-communication between the tech and service adviser. Sometimes being "done" with a repair to the point the customer authorized, isn't the same as being "fixed" as would be the case if a injector tip really did shell the engine. Those kinds of mis-communications happen all the time. That being said, If I were working on something that the customer only wanted partially fixed, and I knew had a junk engine, I don't know that I would bother worrying too much about his pre-existing broken dip stick tube if he doesn't even want me to fix his junk engine. I would equate that to not advising the customer with an estimate to re-attach a rear view mirror to a windshield that has a giant hole in it-after a windshield replacement was declined. Then again, maybe I'm just bias in favor of siding with dealership, I do work for one after all, it's only natural.

Jim Warman · March 19, 2011

We are forever faced with judgement calls.... and the way we present them - and the way the customer takes them - can have a great influence on how an inter-action is going to go...

Let's begin with a customer that is a little shy about going to a dealer to begin with... I can't say for where anyone else lives, but here in Gods country, a dealer is $20 to $40 an hour more than an independant shop.... (spare me the "training" aspect... joe customer doesn't know squat about that BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T TAUGHT HIM ). This guy has had a couple of bad experiences in the past and isn't surprised that his latest visit is a mirror of whatever.

I would think that, at this point, the whole purpose of his dealer visit was to "prove a point" should be an obvious conclusion.

Anyway... Let's consider the term "partially fixed". We are assuming a customer has a deep pocket. After all - when we do a warranty repair, we are blessed with the opportunity to replace any and all suspect parts (as long as we have prior approval). The manual says "remove this bolt and discard it".... and we tell the customer that "this bolt" costs $30 some. Fuck.. let's put ourselves in the customers shoes for a bit...

A dealer estimate will usually come in at "it's my way or the highway".... An independant shop will usually come in with a "good - better - best" estimate.... Good will get you back on the road.... better will give you some small assurance of extra time to save some coin for either further repairs or a down payment... and best will be something you should be able to count on for continued use of this vehicle.

For some reason, dealer techs can forget that they are dealing with somebody just like them.... present them with a mega dollar bill and the situation undergoes a drastic change.

Now... this customer is a little arrogant????? I get the feeling he embarked on this project for a reason that most of us wouldn't like.... The missing bolt is bad enough.... the VC bolt at the very back isn't the stock bolt - not a big deal on a 7.3 (other than why is the bolt like it is) but might cause concern if the head was say 12mm or what-have-you. The dipstick tube? This ain't no small deal....

It is all about customer perception... the sooner we realize that we are here for the customer... the sooner we see that the customer isn't here for us... the better things will be.

This trade has adopted a defensive posture. We defend the right to do shitty work... when we are pressed hard, we defend that right by saying "we don't get paid enough" (extrapolating that, it turns into "we don't get paid enough to do it right" but that's a different story)

This guy set out to make a point... and the dealer named in the story helped him in spades. This isn't the time to get defensive and try to justify what can only be called "malpractice". This is the time to speak out and drum inadequate people out of this business so that those with a real desire and the skills to perform repairs are properly remunerated....

Every last one of us should feel revolted that some "tech" somewhere has set us up for this kind of embarassment.

Keith Browning · March 20, 2011

Anyone notice this guy's video was removed? I wanted to see if his new claim has any validity...

This should be a quick one. Dealing with a bad repair job. Another thread explains. But I am going over the engine today and notice the wiring harness for the tansmission was sitting on the turbo and the wires were melted. About how long would this take. I got it back from the Stealer. Drove it 20 mile before I had to have this towed. I am now in contact with the owner of the stealership and I need a little info before I get him and his service manger on the phone. Thanks.

Matt Saunoras · March 20, 2011

the truck i just buttoned up had a regular bolt on the high pressure rail and a valve cover stud crossthreaded. none of the injector hold downs were torqued tight enough either

i know the shop that did the injectors on that side too. they're pretty big on the truck side of things. makes me wonder if they're having problems with diesel techs

eastendpowerstroke · March 26, 2011

I didn't get to see the video. whats the deal?

Brad Clayton · March 26, 2011

You didn't miss much, you big slacker. Guy had his van worked on and things didn't work out, so he took a video of all the stuff he saw wrong with the van.