Jim Warman Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 While this might seem better suited for the TSB-FSA-SSM forum, it might get better "viewage" here in the 6.4 forum. Ford is, once again, "adjusting" SLTs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshbuys Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 Looks like they just 'stole' all our diag time on these!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Mutter Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 And they will kick back the claim when Ford inspects to pump and finds out its seen water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted April 22, 2011 Author Share Posted April 22, 2011 And they will kick back the claim when Ford inspects to pump and finds out its seen water. Or any scoring that might indicate a lack of lubrication (aka filling with gasoline and doing a half-assed, cheapy repair). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 Okay, I can see the "water" as there usually is evidence of rust on the fuel line fittings which "we" should be able to see but scoring? How are we supposed to know? Seriously! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted April 23, 2011 Author Share Posted April 23, 2011 Okay, I can see the "water" as there usually is evidence of rust on the fuel line fittings which "we" should be able to see but scoring? How are we supposed to know? Seriously! We can't... we are going to be at the mercy of any shop that didn't perform a "filled the tank with gasoline" repair in accordance with Fords recommendations and failed to report the condition. Did something like that happen? I don't know... and it bothers me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Well that is my point. Why should your dealer be held responsible for something you cannot test for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikill Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 We already replaced two under this new tsb. We are saying the same thing. Once it gets too expensive for Ford they will start charging them back. Same thing happened with the thermostat/radiator tsb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Clayton Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Wow, you get a whole 'nother 6 minutes for the extra bolts on a crew cab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Saunoras Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 do you still need to get prior approval under this tsb? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshbuys Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 do you still need to get prior approval under this tsb? Yes, tsb's do not override the need for prior approval. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Okay, after reading through this long TSB, the way I read it, is if I get a 6.4L in for whatever concern, and the only DTC I get is P0088 I am to just simply jump the gun and slam dunk a high pressure fuel pump at this thing, correct? Since cab removal also mandates the draining of fluids, I guess we won't be able to charge that out on the work as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshbuys Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Okay, after reading through this long TSB, the way I read it, is if I get a 6.4L in for whatever concern, and the only DTC I get is P0088 I am to just simply jump the gun and slam dunk a high pressure fuel pump at this thing, correct? Since cab removal also mandates the draining of fluids, I guess we won't be able to charge that out on the work as well. We were told by Ford several months ago to re-use as much of the fluids as possible when doing cab removal. There's always some fluids that have to be replaced when pulling cabs: P/S, Trans, a gallon of coolant, etc. But we had guys here dumping all the coolant and getting 2 or 3 gallons from parts to dump back in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Originally Posted By: mchan68 Okay, after reading through this long TSB, the way I read it, is if I get a 6.4L in for whatever concern, and the only DTC I get is P0088 I am to just simply jump the gun and slam dunk a high pressure fuel pump at this thing, correct? Since cab removal also mandates the draining of fluids, I guess we won't be able to charge that out on the work as well. We were told by Ford several months ago to re-use as much of the fluids as possible when doing cab removal. There's always some fluids that have to be replaced when pulling cabs: P/S, Trans, a gallon of coolant, etc. But we had guys here dumping all the coolant and getting 2 or 3 gallons from parts to dump back in it. Precisely. However not all fluids are easily reclaimable. Coolant however is the easiest. Now, depending on the vehicle mileage and service history it would be prudent to take a coolant test strip and dip it in the coolant to verify it's condition. Takes only a minute or two and depending on the results you can sell the customer a coolant flush service with brandy-dandy new coolant. In my shop that would add about 2 hours to the repair order, Ford is happy, the customer should be happy and you earn more time. I have read many forum posts about reusing coolant and customer's perceptions. Testing it and offering a service tells them that A, you know what you are doing, B, you are not just throwing the "old used up" coolant back in and C, involving the customer. They like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Precisely. However not all fluids are easily reclaimable. Coolant however is the easiest. Now, depending on the vehicle mileage and service history it would be prudent to take a coolant test strip and dip it in the coolant to verify it's condition. Takes only a minute or two and depending on the results you can sell the customer a coolant flush service with brandy-dandy new coolant. In my shop that would add about 2 hours to the repair order, Ford is happy, the customer should be happy and you earn more time. I have read many forum posts about reusing coolant and customer's perceptions. Testing it and offering a service tells them that A, you know what you are doing, B, you are not just throwing the "old used up" coolant back in and C, involving the customer. They like that.Which is all fine and dandy. But what do you do, when you get THOSE kind of customers that have THEIR mechanic, and only show up on our doorstep for stuff they don't have to pay for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Saunoras Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 I absolutely cannot get my service manager to upsell customer pay work on a warranty job. You don't even know how many rads leave this place leaking and the last job I had needed an upper hose too. Customer paid for that only because I ordered it forcing him to sell it. I don't even think he tells half the customers their rads are leaking and i remember one instance where a used truck was sold with one leaking Everything is documented on my end so when the shit hits the fan they won't have anyone to blame Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Which is all fine and dandy. But what do you do, when you get THOSE kind of customers that have THEIR mechanic, and only show up on our doorstep for stuff they don't have to pay for? You put the coolant back into the truck and send them on their way. They get EXACTLY what they want. Then you document what the coolant condition was, what was recommended to the customer and that the service was declined. Done. Let's not stray away from the scenario here. We are talking about a "failed HPFP" that has nothing to do with the cooling system. Had we been discussing something like a failed oil cooler, or an EGR cooler where the coolant has been contaminated it's a whole different scenario and Ford will have to replace the coolant as part of the repair. Let's say you have to remove a cab, the coolant is drained and the AC has to be evacuated. Do you charge Ford for new refrigerant? No. You re-claim it. Same goes for the coolant. It's a simple concept. At that point, coolant condition is still subject to maintenance guidelines. I have re-used coolant many times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Warman Posted April 23, 2011 Author Share Posted April 23, 2011 [quote name=mchan68 Which is all fine and dandy. But what do you do' date=' when you get THOSE kind of customers that have THEIR mechanic, and only show up on our doorstep for stuff they don't have to pay for? [/quote] You document the piss out of your recommendations and do what you are told. I can't speak for anyone else but nobody ever told me that life was going to be fair. The leopard isn't about to change his spots for anyone. (Remember my customer that wanted a reflash to get rid of a persistant P1000 - every time he cleared codes, this code would come back). We can work WITH our team to try and affect a positive change - or we can be a thorn in their side making them all very happy when we leave. Me?- I'm happy with the few things I can do rather than miffed about the many I can't. Life is too short to take too seriously... On edit... what I did neglect to mention is that customers are feeling the same financial squeeze we are feeling... and we don't have to face those high car repair bills. We are, traditionally, $20 to $40 per hour higher than alternative shops... false economy for the most part, but customers seek comfort where they can find it... FWIW, if you look at the bad press some dealerships seem to be able to generate, is there any wonder that some customers are willing to visit shops less equipped than we are? One of the most important things we can do is work with a customer as best we can. Mayhaps we might win his business... mayhaps we wont... First we must attempt it.. and second we must allay his fears and gain his trust. If we aren't prepared to do that.... There's an old racers adage... "nobody 'prepares' to lose". Give it your best or don't fucking bother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikill Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 Okay, after reading through this long TSB, the way I read it, is if I get a 6.4L in for whatever concern, and the only DTC I get is P0088 I am to just simply jump the gun and slam dunk a high pressure fuel pump at this thing, correct? Since cab removal also mandates the draining of fluids, I guess we won't be able to charge that out on the work as well. That's exactly what the tsb says. No more looking for rust or metal which I believe will come back and bite the dealers in the ass when it gets too expensive for Ford. As for the reusing coolant, our shop does all the time. I have tried upselling coolant flushes during certain repairs but I always get the "you have to drain the coolant anyway" response. They don't seem to understand that draining is not the same as flushing and it makes me and the shop more money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchan68 Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 They don't seem to understand that draining is not the same as flushing and it makes me and the shop more money.I have to beg to differ on that one. Customers aren't THAT stupid. And that's the part that most of them see, is trying to make US/THE SHOP more money. I just had a 6.4L that was in for a LPOP gasket replacement, that left my doostep needing a new rad, but the customer declined to repair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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