4.5L & F150 / F250 / Expedition

Keith Browning · May 17, 2005

Anybody heard any news on the future of this engine in the lighter full sized trucks? (i.e. F150 F250 and Expedition) The last I heard the idea was postponed or scrapped but I have been noticing some chatter on the topic on other web sites. I think it will be really interesting to see diesels in the smaller platforms. REAL interesting. I can see the aftermarket performance guys already drooling. :rolleyes:

Ihatevans · May 19, 2005

I have heard from several people that the engineering has been done, and that International has several Exp and F-series with the diesel in them running around their plant. One person (FSE) said that we would see them in 07, another has said that we will not see them unless Chev or Dodge also rolls out a small diesel in their 1/2 tons.

FordMastertech · May 19, 2005

Quote:

One person (FSE) said that we would see them in 07, another has said that we will not see them unless Chev or Dodge also rolls out a small diesel in their 1/2 tons.

This would be stupid on Fords part to wait until the competition gets them out.
FMT

FordTechCA · May 20, 2005

last i heard the reason the V-6 diesel isnt in the F150's and Expeditions already is because it wouldnt meet emission standards and that why its only in the LCF

Keith Browning · May 29, 2005

last i heard the reason the V-6 diesel isn't in the F150's and Expeditions already is because it wouldn't meet emission standards and that why its only in the LCF

I don't think we realize just how much the new emissions standards are are playing a role in what's developing. On top of that the low and ultra low sulfur fuels that we will eventually be seeing will also cause changes. From what I have been reading, if the low sulfur fuels were in use now, the engine manufacturers would probably be having less trouble. Right now, we are looking at new high pressure common rail injection systems, more catalysts and who knows what?! I don't know if it's better to try and rework an engine or start from scratch - but I am not an engineer.

Keith Browning · June 1, 2005

And it's not going to happen - a Power Stroke or ANY diesel in the F-150/250/Expedition. That is the "official" word. At the very least it's not going to happen any time soon. Apparently, Ford and International were developing a totally new, lightweight diesel for light duty trucks. The rumor was 6 cylinder, high pressure common rail injection, twin turbo and some sort of an aluminum block and head. The valve train was to be electronic with variable timing. The entire project was scrapped due to immense development costs and Ford pulled the plug much to International's dissatisfaction because there was a contract to build units and the engine assembly plant was already under construction in Alabama to build the engine. Navistar sued Ford for damages and won a settlement from Ford. This is actually some old news. I would say that caused some bad blood! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/mad.gif

HeuiTim · August 14, 2005

Hi I just joined up, I thought this was the engine that INT. sued Ford over. It is built in AL. it has been in the S. American market for a short time.

http://www.nav-international.com.br/Motores.asp?Idioma=2&Id=12

I think Ford would sell everyone they built if they were available in the F150-Exp. platform. I would buy one of these: http://www.nav-international.com.br/Motores.asp?Idioma=2&Id=59

Tim

Keith Browning · August 14, 2005

Tim, that first link looks interesting. The engine pictured looks almost identical to the 4.5L Ford is using in the LCF. The valve covers look different but the engine basically looks the same. I don't think that this engine would be used in the lighter trucks like the F150. When I was in training the instructor told me that the current 4.5L was much too heavy for those applications and the engine that was being developed was all new but he would not give me any other details. Hey, who knows?

snw blue by you · August 24, 2005

Damn, Thats funny!

Just who would be working on these if they were available in the states?

Not me! I'm to damn busy fixing the current crop of rattlers!

OH NO! I just remembered you can't diag or repair diesels unless you're diesel certified, that is is if you want your warranty money.

Remember, there is no such thing as diesel shop competency.

Cool engines though. I wonder if that is the common rail system we'll see on the 6.4

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/drinkingdude.gif

cochran · July 4, 2006

No, that is not the common rail system for the 6.4. The first link shows an engine using the G2 - HEUI injection system - this is the same system as is currently in use on the 6.0.

The 6.4 will use PCR injection - piezo common rail. The primary difference is this: the G2 HEUI uses the HPOP to amplify the supplied fuel pressure, where the PCR will use a much higher fuel supply pressure.

Keith Browning · July 5, 2006

...putting a high pressure fuel pump in the place where the HPOP is now?

HGM · July 5, 2006

Yes Keith, its very similar otherwise..Its not as far fetched as it seems, to have a 4.5 retrofitted with common rail..... The injection system and weight are what killed the 4.5 for the F-150, a different design with the new carbon technology makes much more sense.. Guess we'll just have to see..

gasgasman · July 6, 2006

Here's the Jaguar 2.7L V6 diesel.

Posted Image

(Image fixed by the diesel fairy /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif )

gasgasman · July 6, 2006

Sorry, the photo link would not work.

Jaguar web site

WGLR13MWZ · August 3, 2006

Quote:

Automotive News / August 2, 2006 - 6:00 am

DETROIT - Ford Motor Company will expand its use of six-speed automatics and introduce engines that are expected to dramatically upgrade the refinement and performance of its vehicles in the next five years.

Fuel economy is expected to improve incrementally as well.

Ford is focusing its powertrain engineering in four areas: diesel engines for light-duty trucks and SUVs, higher horsepower V-8s for cars and trucks, gasoline-electric hybrids and six-speed automatic transmissions.

Here's what's on tap:

Diesel engines: At year end, Ford will replace its troubled 6.0-liter Power Stroke diesel truck engine after just five model years.

In the first quarter of 2007, Ford's redesigned 2008 Super Duty trucks will be powered by a 6.4-liter diesel V-8 with a state-of-the-art piezo fuel injection system.

Ford engineers have finally resolved most of the 6.0-liter's quality issues, but the change is being made to boost power as well as comply with tightening emission regulations that take effect in January. The new engine will enable Ford to keep pace with General Motors' and Dodge's new diesel engines.

Look for the new 6.4-liter diesel, manufactured for Ford by International Truck and Engine Corp., to deliver 350 hp and around 625 pounds-feet of torque.

For light-duty trucks, such as the F-150 and Ford Expedition, Ford may use a 4.4-liter diesel V-8, based on a smaller engine used by its Land Rover division, beginning in 2010.

I didnt post the entire article b/c it was off topic about other vehicles and engines.