opinions on 08' and newer super duty

[dieseldoc]

Well I have outgrown my 06' F-250 ext. cab, and looking to move into an F-350 drw or F-450 crewcab. I have been shopping now for about a year and been focusing on 00' to 07' trucks. However am having no luck finding what I want that doesnt already have 200,000 plus miles on it. I have been toying with several ideas and looking for some opinions from guys in the trenches working on this newer stuff. I really like the new 11' and up body style, however I am not excited about the hefty price tag. Or the emmissions equipment on them, worried about very large bills for parts and what not once off warranty. . . I have also been considering widening my search into the 6.4 model years, my issue there is once again aftertreatment issues and fuel mileage.I have no experience with the pickup models, but i recall the service trucks we had at my old job(f-550 with cranes and what not) was terrible in the fuel mileage area single digits. Looking for opinions on whether you guys would perosnally own the newer stuff or stay away from it and stick with the older stuff, as well as common things to look for if purchasing one of these trucks. sorry for the long post, but thanks for the input guys.

[mchan68]

Diesel Particle Filter. Regeneration. 6 mpg.

[YukonTyler]

I have an '08 6.4, regular cab, ZF tranny, 4x4 (manual hubs) with a Trailtech flat deck. I bough tit with 40 000 km an it's currently sitting at 51 000. Paid $18 000, and in my neck of the woods a clean 7.3 is only a few thousand cheaper.

 

The first thing I did was to get rid of the DPF and run a (very conservative) tune. I know that wont endear me to some on this forum, but the immediate benefits to the owner are hard to ignore. Mileage is reasonable @ 17 litres/100 km (14 MPG), but before the modification it was 22 litres/100 km (10 MPG). To me this mileage is acceptable, but the truck is not my daily driver. I usually keep a beater 4-cylinder around for that. Also, it no longer builds oil, and this was actually the main reason why I did the change.

 

I am paranoid about the engine itself. Aside from my own trucks I do not wrench on diesels, and because of that I know I'm not the ideal person to own one of these things. Instead I find myself trying to address every little noise and leak when it crops up in hopes of avoiding a complete grenade. So far all I have done on the engine is an injector on #2. At times I wonder if I should have went and found a 5.4 or a 6.8 just for the increased familiarity, but so far so good.

 

Otherwise the truck is darn solid. I bought it knowing that it needed a rad, cam sensor o-rings, a tensioner and rear shocks. No surprises there. The only super common things that I've not had to deal with is a blend door actuator issue, dust seals and a leaking bed plate. If you're looking at a dually then I definitely do enough rear wheel seals, but that's not a big deal.

 

Good luck! If you can find the right truck at the right price then I wouldn't shy away.

[Jim Warman]

My sons 08 is (I believe) something over 300,000 kms. His fuel is supplied.

 

Not long ago, his DPF became a problem. I tried a Mexican Manual Regen - no joy. For something like $1600 CAD my cost, I can rest knowing that my grandsons Dad and I have done everything in our power to help preserve the planet that he will come to depend on. No aftermarket modules - no defeating emissions controls.

 

Or is this where I heave this old carcase up on the soap box and trot out my patented "we are the keepers of the public trust" speech?

[dieseldoc]

I am with you Jim I refuse to "delete" any emissions devices and throw some programming in it. My nephews and hopefully kids will have enough shit to deal with in life in the future, let alone the environmental problems we have created. I am currently getting 16 average with my 6.0 and 12ish loaded, would like to stay close to that. I really wish I had followed my gut in 06 and just ordered the crewcab dually than. I am leaning more towards finding like an 01, or 02 7.3 and building it into what I am looking for. However I need something that my wife can take with the horse trailer for the weekend without me and I dont have to worry about it. Thanks for the thoughts keep em coming. . . .

[YukonTyler]

I knew that reaction was coming, but I'm still glad that I gave an honest response to the question. Like it or not the DPF delete does have its place in a discussion on fuel economy and that's why I opted to bring it up.

 

If folks would like to indulge in the 'soap box' then it should come in a separate thread and not stray from Doc's original topic. Interestingly enough, I'd be curious to measure NOx and particulate emissions from an old 7.3 as a daily driver vs a DPF deleted 6.4 or 6.7.

[Jim Warman]

Kieth - as per Tylers suggestion - can you find a good home for this side bar?

 

Your comparison might be mildly interesting as a comparison of combustion chamber and/or fuel delivery technology. But the engineers can already predict when NOx formation is going to occur.

 

Now, this next bit is likely going to ssound a tad harsh to some, but if we leave a pile of crap under thje corner of the rug, it will have to be addressed some how, some day.

 

If your hypothetical situation yields tailpipe emissions cleaner than the old technology being replaced, the point is moot. Especially considering DPFs do NOT address NOx and other gaseous emissions. The fact remains that the situation does not meet legal requirements.

 

Back in the day - I had my first go 'round with gas EGR valves in 1973 - back in the day, most of us (not situated in the "smog hot spots") had cavalier attitudes towards all these new fangled problem children... indeed, vacuum powered emissions devices were a huge part of the problem themselves.

 

Today, we don't have the concerns with actuating devices like we had 40 years ago. But to say "I unhooked this shit but it could be worse" would be like me saying "they scraped out my lungs and now I can breathe - I guess we don't need to worry about the spots on my brain " (sorry if that offends anyone but it is my spots and my brain and my reality - and I see an opportunity to cash in on it ).

[Aaron]

I love my 08.

 

I'm at 176,000km on the original brake pads.

 

I need to swap out the temperature door motor, it's not working right, aside from that it's been a pretty good truck to me. Just put a radiator in it at 165,000kms.

 

Maintenance on these is a big thing, and I personally would never buy one not knowing the maintenance history, unless it was a STEAL, and you knew going into it it may be problematic.

[Jim Warman]

Bingo on the maintenance. The previous operator of this truck is almost my kids uncle and I am the "usual suspect" for service and repairs since day the first. Fuel filters every second oil change - that kind of stuff.

 

When my son first got the truck, I was quite concerned. Now, the truck has paid for itself and I look back wondering why I ever worried. We'd do it all over again providing our two basic tenets - no aftermarket bullshit chips. And I want to be somewhat familiar with vehicle history.

[Bruce Amacker]

I think a large portion of keeping the bottom of a 6.4 intact is watching your STFT religiously.........

 

[dieseldoc]

I am religious about maintenance with my vehicles, so no problem there. So if a guy found a rig that was a 1 owner with good maintenance history you wouldnt shy away from it? I personally havent worked on one of the newer trucks other than oil and filters. But reading through the forums on here you see the horror stories of melted pistons and blown up engines, makes a guy a bit leary of getting in to one of these trucks used. Poor maintenance is the killer of anything, but these seem to be more susceptible catastophic consequences. What kind of mileage are you guys seeing the 6.4, 6.7 trucks, if you own one or happen to notice the overhead monitors(I know there not accurate but a ballpark). I have found a couple of trucks here that intrigue me, but have shyed away so far. maybe I will go look at em and get some info on them. One is n 09' and the other is a 11', things specific a guy should look for?

[lmorris]

My take is this- You should have one of 2 reasons for owning a diesel pick-up. 1: the truck makes you a shit tonne of money and you can afford the fuel and maintenance with out modifications. 2: You already have a shit tonne of money to afford the fuel and maintenance with out modifications.

 

IMO any Ford Superduty is an awesome truck. The engine choice should bepend on your budget and useage.

[DieselD]

I would own a 7.3(actually do), I would own a 6.0 of any year, I would own a 6.7 but I would never own a 6.4!

 

What worries me for the future of that engine is the parts cost and availability, resale value of the truck is very poor, fuel mileage is shit and they are super finicky. Sure you can do things like DPf delete and tuners to correct some of the Regen problems however then you have the whole EPA thing to worry about....Personally I would avoid at all costs

[mrbudge]

In my experience, problems with all modern diesels are rooted in improper operation (do you really need 600 ft/lbs of torque to idle in Tim Horton's parking lot clogging up your egr valve and filling your crankcase) and improper service. Therefore, if you are going to buy one, do you really need one, and if you do, do you trust the last greasy mechanic that worked on it to do a good job (I don't).

[dieseldoc]

Well guys I think I have made up my mind and going to go with my original idea. I am going to find a 01" or 02" truck that is close and make it the truck I am searching for. I will find a solid crew cab 7.3 truck with a 6spd and build the rest of the truck to my specs. May take a while longer but in the end I think that is about the only way I am going to be satisfied with what I have. Thanks for all the input guys

[dieseldoc]

Well guys I know I said I made up my mind a while ago but i guess I didnt. I have found a 12' f-350 crew with a 6.7, that I really like and the "director of finance" at home also likes. It is a used truck with 35,000 mi on it. Seems a bit high in the mileage dept for this new a truck... I have a few questions for you guys that have been working on em a few years now. 1) Do you see alot of aftertreatment problems, such as regen issues or scr troubles? 2) Seeing any pattern failures a guy should look for at certain mileage ranges? 3)How are parts for these things hard to get/rediculously expensive? 4)I know in the beginning you guys were seeing valves failing and taking out engines, is this still an issue or gotten better in the 12 and 13 model years? thanks for the info guys.

[Aaron]

I just put a turbocharger on one because the wheel(s) came off of it. 110k miles, truck is also on it's second engine. 2011 truck

 

There is a TSB for replacing the exhaust valves for a rough run during regeneration condition as well.

[Steve Mutter]

I would get an esp warranty but don't get diesel care, i don't think it covers the after treatment stuff. I think the only real problem with these new diesels is if you get a fault with the after treatment system you could be sitting on the side of the road in the middle of no wear idling to the next Ford dealer. I don't know why they are so hard on diesel, why doesn't a gas car go into idle only mode when there is a fault with the emission system. I know that not all faults with the after treatment system will put you into idle only mode, I just think that part of it is a real down side.

[mchan68]

Let's just make this plain and simple. They're all absolute pieces on junk on wheels that will either leave you on the side of the road in the middle of nowhere, or completely drain you of all your savings in the costs of repairs. There now, that was easy.

[DieselD]

my dad has a early 2011 and its been great. Its had some some goofy things here and there but nothing to be worried about. He is sitting around 75k miles now and tows a 35' 5th wheel trailer often. I would be looking at a 6.7 long before even concidering a 6.4