05' 6L won't run under load.

Revitup6k · February 28, 2014

Got a E450 in with a complaint that the vehicle wouldn't go more than 10mph. Confirmed the complaint, and found that the engine loads up when you press the brake, and then even more if you put it in gear and will slowly begin to die especially if you increase AP while braking in drive. Sounds like it runs out of fuel. Only codes are for cyl 8 GP, and cyl 3&5 contibution. The EGR is clean, the EBP tube and sensor are clean, the turbo spools, I disconnected the cat that didn't help. The pids are pretty norm, EXCEPT Engine Load, at idle in park it reads 66%, press the brake and it jumps to 99.7%. This has a hydraboost on it. Removed the belt and ran it, the engine sounded a bit better, but it still wanted to stall. Ideas?

Keith Browning · March 1, 2014

What is your fuel pressure?

Brad Clayton · March 1, 2014

Got a E450 in with a complaint that the vehicle wouldn't go more than 10mph. Confirmed the complaint, and found that the engine loads up when you press the brake, and then even more if you put it in gear and will slowly begin to die especially if you increase AP while braking in drive. Sounds like it runs out of fuel. Only codes are for cyl 8 GP, and cyl 3&5 contribution. The EGR is clean, the EBP tube and sensor are clean, the turbo spools, I disconnected the cat that didn't help. The pids are pretty norm, EXCEPT Engine Load, at idle in park it reads 66%, press the brake and it jumps to 99.7%. This has a hydraboost on it. Removed the belt and ran it, the engine sounded a bit better, but it still wanted to stall. Ideas?

E-boxes are a little stranger when diagnosing compared to trucks. You probably are running out of fuel at the injectors. Will this idle in park ok? If it starts loping and running oddly (fuel knock) after idling for a bit, you could have combustion gasses displacing the fuel in the head. Does this thing have a steel fuel tank? If so it could be experiencing a delam issue and clogging up the fuel system. What's the miles and hours? If they are astronomical, then I would get a quick reading on crankcase pressure before heading any further. All the above items are easy to check and thus eliminate as possible causes.

Revitup6k · March 1, 2014

Fuel pressure is 49psi. 131k miles, unsure of hrs... it will idle in park, but if you hit the accel it takes a bit for it to rev up. (Its been in warm garage for 4days now). There is a steel tank, but both filters were removed and examined and appear to be fine. I'm going to check for bubbles at my stand pipe now.

Revitup6k · March 1, 2014

I got it. I had exhaust coming out of my stand pipe, must have an injector off its seat. Thanks for the help!

Keith Browning · March 1, 2014

That will do it but now which cylinder is it?

Revitup6k · March 2, 2014

Given I had two inj codes from the same bank, I'm going to tackle that side first, I will be suggesting to replace the set though.

Aaron · March 2, 2014

Since nothing on an econoline is fun to change, why not balloon test it first?

Keith Browning · March 2, 2014

I think a lot of guys still have not run into this concern over the years. The thing about identifying which cylinder or bank is you need to look at it from different angles. I no longer like the balloon test as in situations like this one where the engine still runs, it may never produce enough gasses to show any movement in the balloon... let alone inflate one. That is why I prefer looking for bubbles in the secondary fuel filter housing. The proper way to identify the failed injector is to remove the glow plugs one at a time until no bubbles are observed while cranking. Personally, I think that if you can watch the power balance display and observe on injector drop out and the subsequently see additional injectors on the same bank drop out you know where you are headed.

Regardless of which injector it is, the common recommendation is to replace all of the injectors on the bank as the combustion gasses commonly damage them and future repeat failures are likely to occur. The Hot-Line always recommends this as well as replacing the inlet check valve on the cylinder head of the affected bank.

Also, when inspecting don't always assume the first injector that shows low on cylinder balance or the one setting a contribution code is the offender. I recently had a PSE&G truck brought to me that had injector #1 replaced and failed 4 times! FOUR times!!! I removed all of the injectors on bank one and discovered that #3 was the culprit causing the havoc. Of course all 4 were replaced and the truck has been fine ever since.

Lastly, we need to inspect the failed injector and determine how the combustion gasses are entering the fuel rail through it and what caused it. The obvious failures are when the copper seal at the tip of the injector burns up and gets pounded . Once this occurs combustion cases quickly burn up the lower fuel rail o-ring and compression enters the fuel rail directly. The injector could have been loose for several reasons but regardless, the injector cup must be closely inspected for any damage and replaced as necessary or a repeat failure WILL OCCUR. The other scenario is when combustion gasses leak through the needle and seat indicating an internal failure of the injector on the fuel side. This is where investigating fuel quality, verifying fuel pressure and identifying and correcting issues is critical otherwise... repeat failures will occur. These failures are generally quite involved to diagnose and expensive to repair especially when we find rusted fuel tanks which in my experience is the most common root cause with neglect and clogged filters a close second.

Brad Clayton · March 2, 2014

I always take a real close look at the injector area between the orings. It should be nice and shiny, if it's brown and discolored, then it's time to drop the fuel tank. If you ignore it, the vehicle will be back shot gun wedding style.

Keith Browning · March 2, 2014

Yes indeedie Brad! The brown staining is a clear sign of rust. Sometimes it looks like actual corrosion and other times it looks like staining. I swear that rust can dissiolve into small enough particles to make it past the filters suspended in the fuel just as water can - or perhaps it's rusty water suspended in the fuel.