First Oil cooler/EGR cooler on a school bus

[the_twig_187]

so I just completed my first oil cooler and egr cooler on a 2004 e-350 school bus. all and all it went fairly well. the exhaust to manifold bolts rotted and broke so I had to heat them and punch them out and the right hand fuel line from the bowl to the right head broke and needed replacement. got the whole job done in 19hrs and the job was quoted by another tech for 12hrs total so I lost about a days pay but the next one will for sure go smoother.

[lmorris]

Love the intake port block offs. 

[the_twig_187]

lol cant be too safe. painters tape and some blocks of wood to hold the tape down

[lmorris]

lol cant be too safe. painters tape and some blocks of wood to hold the tape down

Amen to that. I have a couple of sets of the red plastic covers that used to come with remans.

[eastendpowerstroke]

so I lost about a days pay but the next one will for sure go smoother.

HA!

[mchan68]

It's been a LOOOOOONNNNNG time since I've been under the hood of one of these........... and I don't miss it one bit.

[eastendpowerstroke]

4 school bus companies, 1 major County transportation company, most of the local ambulances PD and FD, plus contractors and other work vans. I'm way to familiar with subsidizing 6.0l van repairs out of my pocket.

[Matt Saunoras]

Noticed the fan and stator still in place.  This is a simple reminder to me that I've never worked on an e-series 6.0 with a single alternator.

[eastendpowerstroke]

Tech tip, I suggest putting a small zip tie around the fuel lines to keep the nut near the end. It saves the headache of fishing them back up when they slide down the tube.

[forddieseldoctor]

I take it you didn't flush the cooling system when you were done? I do every one that gets either head gaskets, oil cooler or egr cooler.

[the_twig_187]

whats your procedure for flushing the cooling system? do you use the cv-9? do you run the vehicle with the rad plug out while filling the degas bottle with a garden hose? do you use a fancy flush machine? do you pull out the water jacket plugs on the block? what gave you the assumption that I did not flush the cooling system? I truly did not flush the cooling system after the repair im just curious as to what gave it away?

[Matt Saunoras]

The labor quote gave it away.

[Keith Browning]

The FIRST thing you should take away from this is that @12 hours the job was quoted at LESS THAN WARRANTY time. I would be pissed off at the people I work with for not properly quoting the job. As a CP labor job I would have quoted a MINIMUM of 19 hours...  More depending on condition of the vehicle and more for any body related equipment (bus) that is in the way requiring removal - stuff that is not listed in the TSB or STLS guide. That would normally be add-on M-time operations above and beyond.

 

Did you even run OASIS and read TSB 09-8-3?

[Alex Bruene]

I'd have let whoever quoted it at 12 hours do the job.  Thankfully those things don't have A/C, so it makes it easier.

[mchan68]

Okay, I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought 12 hours was WAY light for that job. When quoting any retail work, my motto is "go high and possibly lose the job, or go low and lose your shirt". Which of the two would you rather lose?

[Matt Saunoras]

Hahaha I just lost my shirt this week. It's been a while but it happens unfortunately

[Bruce Amacker]

Labor Information Skill Level Mfg. Warranty Standard

Oil Cooler, Engine

       

Replace

B 7.0 9.8

NOTE

       

With Dual Alternators, Add

B 0.3 0.4 Labor Information Skill Level Mfg. Warranty Standard

EGR Cooler

Replace

       

Cooler

B 6.6 8.8

NOTE

       

With Dual Alternators, Add

B 0.3 0.4

 

 

Alldata gives 13.6 warranty time and 18.6 CP plus dual alts PLUS TIME FOR BEING 10 YEARS OLD. Keith and everyone is right on with this one, way too little time.

 

[the_twig_187]

wow im glad you guys have my back on this one. I punched on and off when ever I worked on the van while ordering broken parts and came up to 19 hrs. I have been a technician for 4 years now and graduated and wrote my licence back in November. I have tried very hard to educate myself after working hours via this web site, ford web courses and picking the brain of other techs. but having only been in this for 4 years I missed the hay-day of the 6 liter so I wasn't even aware that the oil cooler/ egr cooler was a TSB... good to know and next time I will use that as my advantage when "I" quote the job.

 

Alex is right tho with the a/c removed it was a ton easier. I also put a prybar on the right valve cover and pry the serpentine belt/tensioner until I can lock it. that way I could leave the fan and the stator attached which also saved time.

 

thanks for the help guys, im very thankful for all your guys input it give me a lot of confidence in myself.

 

So because the two jobs overlap each other my question is what is a fair charge for both the customer and myself for this job (assuming no complications occur and further time is needed)?

 

should you always flush the cooling system afterwards? if you don't have a fancy flush machine, how would you flush the system?

 

Chris

[forddieseldoctor]

Look in the workshop manual under cooling system general procedures for the flush procedure. I use the pto wire to hold the rpm up instead of tying up an ids for an hour. I also have an extra apcm for the 03's and 04's that don't have a pto circuit.

And yes the labor time was way light to have performed the flush on top of the repair.

 

I would highly recommend running oasis on everything. You never know what you're gonna find. It wouldn't hurt to bring up all tsb's for each year of the 6.0's and scan through them as you get time.

[Matt Saunoras]

Good advice there. I run oasis and look at warranty history on nearly everything I work on.  Countless times it's helped out, you can't ever have too much information at hand.

 

I have a special "flushing brick."  It's perfect rectangular shape holds the accelerator pedal perfectly, as an added bonus it's infinitely adjustable and has a rough texture to assure maximum grip to the maintain its position. 

[Keith Browning]

I have a special "flushing brick."

 

I also have a "flushing brick" that has a double use as my "blow up brick."

 

I love tools that multi-task - they don't call me the "Alton Brown" of mechanics for nothing!

[Aaron]

If it runs and the EGR isn't fucked up I'd rather flush the cooling system before swapping the oil cooler. I've seen trucks plug up new oil coolers when flushed after the new stuff is installed and flushed.

 

I understand that sometimes this isn't possible but I find it works the best.

[the_twig_187]

would you recommend this guys cooling flush procedure?

 

(tried to copy and paste the link but it wouldn't work...how do I copy and paste a youtube link? I cant seem to copy or paste anything in the typing window)

 

 

 

[forddieseldoctor]

Not trying to be an ass, but they have this nifty little thing called a workshop manual.

 

[the_twig_187]

Yes several people have mentioned the wsm. I was just wondering if anyone else has a good flush procedure that's not so labour intensive. I'll just refer to the wsm