GregH

Even more graphs for you guys... First, the CKP wiring issue... This is from pin 30: And this is from pin 30, after swapping pins 30 and 41 - this one is a "proper" CKP waveform: Unfortunately, the truck requires an extremely long crank time to start, and it runs like shit. The tach also jumps alot at idle. So, I swapped the pins back. Evidently on this vehicle, the first CKP waveform is correct. Now, the CMP vs CMPO at below cutout speed: And again: Now, just barely bumping cutout: And at WOT, so the cutouts happen more frequently and violently: And again: It looks to me like the CMP input is good. However, it is quite obvious that the CMP out is bad. I did swap the FICM off a known good truck, per the field service engineer's suggestion, and it did not make a difference. Also, the noise that we see/saw on the CMP line - it's still present with the battery charger off the vehicle. The alternator field and output are still disconnected. The noise is not nearly as bad when the engine is at KOEO, but still there. Anyway, there you go.... Again, thanks guys....

Good thoughts on the alternator - It was unplugged the whole time (first thing pulled, been burned there before). But, the truck was hooked to a battery charger running wide open. I didn't notice the backwards CKP waveform. Good call. I'll verify the proper wiring before continuing. As for the first CMPO graph, your right. That was at high speed, just below cutout. My bad. The noise present on the CMP line in the first graph may be misleading. I had adjusted the scope settings between the first and second graphs, and the y-axis has twice the resolution in the first graph than in the second and third graphs. I had adjusted the time base too... A field service engineer called me back last night and advised me to swap a known good FICM onto this truck. So, I'll do that, and then make some more readings when that doesn't change anything. The suggestion was for a CKP(+) graph to verify wiring, and a CMP(+)/CMPO graph. Anything else? Oh, and remove the battery charger while graphing... Thanks for the assistance, guys. I don't know what I'd do without it....

Ok, got some data. First, second and third images are scope patterns of the engine running at about 3100 rpm, and dropping FICMSYNC every few seconds - kinda like just barely bumping a rev limiter. As you can see, it looks like there is no problem with the signal, except for some noise on the CMP line. Now, we have the CMPO and CKPO signals. However, it appears that I didn't get a good connection to one of them. Backprobing is sometimes hit or miss on this connector. However, the line I did make good contact with looks good: That was at a low RPM. When I boosted the RPM to the trucks cutout speed, I noticed this: and this, even more pronounced: I'm thinking the PCM is taking SYNC information and processing it incorrectly at higher frequencies. The FICM doesn't know what to do with the long square wave, and looses sync, therefore cuts off the injectors. I'm thinking PCM....

Yes, I'll do it after I finish this last vehicle. Since I don't have the 104 to PTEC adapter, it'll be a cranking pattern... But I'll see if I can backprobe the connectors and getting a running pattern. Also, I've still got your crank sensor set aside. I'll mail it as soon as I get a chance.

Heh.. Installed my short block. No real problems there... Started it up, matted the pedal, and the engine won't rev past 2600 rpm. Uhhh, that's a little slow.. Anyway, a little testing, and a hotline call later, and another short block was on the way. Recieved short block #2, inspected and rejected based on a nick on the crank trigger wheel. Ordered another short block. Recieved short block #3, inspected and approved. Off with the cab, out with the "old" and in with the new, slam the cab back down and spin the key - now it won't rev past 3200 rpm. Progress, I guess. Yeah, anyway, FICMSYNC starts to flicker from yes to no at 3200 rpm, and the rpm pid goes erratic. Feels like it hits a rev limiter. This condition wasn't present with the original engine. A new engine control harness and FICM harness were installed with the second short block (block #3). New crank and cam sensors have been installed and swapped a few times. Ehhh, field service engineer is on the way... Not that I mind slinging blocks, I just kinda wish this one would go away... Did I mention this one belongs to the husband of the woman who signs my paychecks?

The two labor ops I claimed on my last one was 6007a - 12.3, 6007a1 - 8.5, plus diagnosis. Thats over 20 right there.

So, my spouse is always exposed to secondhand 6.0. She's been witness to all the frustrations and successes I've had while working on these beasts. She's given me a gift this year, and I'd like to share it with you. I give you the 12 days of a diesel guru's Christmas... Enjoy! On the first day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me A broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the second day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me A warranty R.O. And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the third day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. ON the fourth day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the fifth day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me F-I-I-I-V-E “O” RINGS! “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the sixth day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me Six pissed off comebacks, F-I-I-I-V-E “O” RINGS! “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the seventh day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me Only seven glow plugs, Six pissed off comebacks, F-I-I-I-V-E “O” RINGS! “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the eighth day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me Eight freakin’ recalls, Only seven glow plugs, Six pissed off comebacks, F-I-I-I-V-E “O” RINGS! “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the ninth day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me Nine new TSBs, Eight freakin’ recalls, Only seven glow plugs, Six pissed off comebacks, F-I-I-I-V-E “O” RINGS! “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the tenth day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me Ten techs a cussin’, Nine new TSBs, Eight freakin’ recalls, Only seven glow plugs, Six pissed off comebacks, F-I-I-I-V-E “O” RINGS! “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the eleventh day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me Eleven leaking D Rings, Ten techs a cussin’, Nine new TSBs, Eight freakin’ recalls, Only seven glow plugs, Six pissed off comebacks, F-I-I-I-V-E “O” RINGS! “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key. On the twelfth day of Christmas, Ford Motor gave to me Twelve parts busted "in shipping," Eleven leaking D Rings, Ten techs a cussin’, Nine new TSBs, Eight freakin’ recalls, Only seven glow plugs, Six pissed off comebacks, F-I-I-I-V-E “O” RINGS! “Those parts are on back order…” “This HAS to go TODAY!” A warranty R.O., And a broken diesel, with a shiny key.

Ok, so I've got an '06 in for a long crank time. Pretty straightforward, slow to build ICP, P2291 present in memory, and the hotter the oil, the longer it takes to start. But I was watching some data, and had FUELPW up as one of the PIDs - having just come off the cluster that is my '03 long crank time that recieved a short block... FUELPW pulses to about 3ms for a short time - almost like the computer is trying to bump up the cranking speed with some sort of burn, however crappy the injection would be at low ICP. It looks like the ICP slowly rams to the 300ish range, pretty much stabilizes there, then the computer goes ahead and pops the injectors a few times with a long pulse width. This injects some fuel into the cylinders, it burns, and bumps the cranking speed up enough to allow the high pressure pump to overcome the leaks. I observed the cranking speed bump up from 170's to 220's. Check out the capture: Interesting stuff...

Yep, cam trigger pins can back out and even fall completely out. The hotline guy was telling me about an incident where he advised the tech to stick a pencil into the cam sensor hole and roll the engine over slowly. The pencil slipped furthur into the block when the pin hole came 'round. Keith - I scoured that thread while reaserching this problem, and I stole a copy of your sync.pdf. Did it have sample waveforms attatched to it at one time? Bruce - thanks for the 6.4 graph. I didn't have my settings optimized on the oscilloscope, and I apologize for that. When I get time, I'll scope it again. Either way, the ball is rolling for a short block. The cam sensor getting hit was enough to justify an engine for me... Again, if this truck had belonged to anyone else - instead of our office manager - I would have kicked them to the curb... Oh, and I had another first - The first call to the hotline resulted in me getting a complete tool for an engineer. Treated me like I had never seen a 6.0 before, and fixated on some mysterious high pressure leak (that the IDS graphs showed didn't exist). I couldn't make him understand that it was a sync issue, even when I finally coaxed him into looking at the data I had uploaded. ("well, did you select all of our recommended PIDs?" "No, I didn't know you had a list. I do have the pertinant ones, though." "There's no point in me looking at the recordings if you don't have all the data we request." "You haven't requested any data yet!!") Second hotline guy finally got the idea. It's inspiring to see (hear?) the lightbulb turn on in their minds. "lets see.. Ohhhh.. there is a long delay before the sync pids turn to yes.." bingbingbingbingbing! motor will be here monday. we'll see....

Well, finally got some solid information. Using the sync.pdf I found on here, I hooked up to graph the crank and cam signals. (by the way, I couldn't make the cam signal work until after I grounded CMP-) Looks ok, I guess. I see some amplitude variation in the CKP signal, like a wavy tone ring. During the time that I couldn't get a CMP signal, I decided to remove the CMP sensor. Found the cam timing peg had hit the sensor. Replaced with a new one, got my signal by grounding CMP-, and graphed my signals. Called the hotline with a simple question - that they weren't able to answer - so I'll pose it here. At what point in the crankshaft rotation should the camshaft sensor signal peak? In other words, is this engine "slightly" out of time, like a tone ring on the crankshaft slipped slightly? Now, back to the cam sensor - I took the new one back out, and found a slight mark on the tip of the sensor. Timing peg hit the new one too... Short block time. I wonder if the crank tone ring is wavy? I wonder if the peg holding the crank tone ring is intact? Wonder if that will fix the 2.5 second crank time, or if all of this is a red herring? Such is the life of the diesel tech...

Here's some screenshots... First one is the sick truck. Note the amount of time the engine is cranking before the sync's turn to yes. And this one is the one I fixed yesterday. First start after sitting outside all night in below freezing temperatures.

By the looks of the data, the engine has got everything it needs to start. ICPV is well above .8, RPM is sufficient (although I did "borrow" a pair of batteries from parts and gained about 20rpm - no difference), system voltage stays above 10.5V, and the FICM powers look good. It really looks like the PCM is not recognizing the crank and cam signals right. Every time, the SYNC and FICMSYNC PIDs will wait about 2.5 seconds before toggling. FICMSYNC goes first, then FUELPW changes from 0 to around 2ms, then SYNC goes to yes. These last three things happen within less than 1/10th of a second. Then a few tenths of a second later, then engine starts. I'll make some recordings of the '03 I fixed yesterday (high pressure leak) and post the two graphs here for you to peruse, if you don't mind... Thanks, guys...

Ehhh... Got a "problem" vehicle. Hot or cold, you get in the truck, hit the key, and it has to crank over for 2.5 seconds before it starts. Not a problem, right? The truck belongs to the office manager that signs my paycheck... Yeah, it's a problem. Codes - U0306 for software incompatibiity in the FICM. Truck is programmed, knew that. Restore to stock using the programmer, and flash the three modules to the latest level with the IDS. No codes have come up since then, and I've gotten rid of the P1000. Ok, so looking at some PIDs now. Mean cranking RPM is in the 180's. ICP/IPR are by the book. Plenty of ICP right off the bat. Stabilizes around 1500psi during cranking before it starts. (Voltage also correlates, but I can't remember it right off the top of my head.) FUELPW remains 0 until FICMSYNC toggles to "Yes." Then FUELPW goes to around 2ms and the engine immediately starts. 40,000 miles on the truck, meticulously maintained (by me). The 2.5 seconds of crank time doesn't vary at all - hot, cold, soak time, whatever. I had the opportunity to work on another '03 for a high pressure leak. 209,000 on the clock, and after clearing the air out of the high pressure system, all you have to do is bump the key and it starts up. Hotline says as long as the truck doesn't exceed 7 seconds of cranking, then there is no issue. Wish I could tell the owner that.... Any help, guys? Thanks...

So, what happens if you remove the lower left side plug on a 7.3L high pressure oil pump? Had a customer come in the other day with a drivabiity problem on his '01 (or so). P1209, runs poorly, ICP at 400psi idle, IPR at 20%. Mentions that he just pulled the pump out to replace the o-rings. I tells him "Ya don't gotta pull the pump for that." He sez "Ya, to get to that plug down low." "But you don't get that o-ring in da kit..." "Ya, I just matched it up." So I sez "You need a pump now, buddy. Guess we're done here!" But what happens if you remove that plug and reinstall it? Does it damage the pump? What exactly does it damage?

You're right. With current conventional engine design, there is no way to hit 100mpg. Lighten the vehicles, improve the engine design, and we'd still be really pushing to clear 50mpg. And we start getting into the realm of safety concerns - being such a light vehicle... Bruce Crower came up with a very interesting design - the six cycle engine. I apologize if he's been discussed here before - can't remember where I first heard of his engine design. If you're not familiar with his design, google it. Interesting reading, and quite an innovative design. With adequate refinement, it could be a real contender... What would really be nice is to convert the entire volume of gasoline into useable energy, instead of the exceedingly low percentage that we have now. If there was a way to convert the entire mass into energy (remember e=mc2?) and actually use the energy to move the vehicle with no waste, it would only take 1 drop of fuel to power a full size vehicle 200,000 miles. Obviously, we can't do that, nor will we be able to do that in the future. There will always be waste (damn entropy!) Nuclear power is an interesting concept. It utilizes energy conversion through e=mc2. Uranium-235 (among others) is easily fissible, which means it will easily fall apart. When it does, plutonium, curium, and other isotopes of uranium are made, as well as a significant amount of heat. Where does the heat come from? It is energy from e=mc2. If you add up the mass of the fuel before it enters a nuclear reactor, and compare it to the mass when the spent fuel comes back out, you'll find that you've got less mass. The lost mass was converted directly into energy. Sweet! Nuclear reactors are closed loop. There is no "exhaust pipe" or "intake" for the radioactive stuff. (there is for the support mechanisms. Typically water from a nearby source goes through a heat exhanger, flashes to steam, drives a turbine, and is released back to the environment.) You put the fuel in, retract the control rods, and the reaction starts by itself. You throttle the reaction with the depth of the control rods, until the fuel is spent. Swap the fuel for fresh, and away you go... Fission is nice, but fusion is better. Fission is the breaking apart of things - in this case atoms. Fusion is the combination of things - again atoms. In stars, the main fusion fuel is hydrogen - it fuses into helium. The two hydrogen atoms weigh more than the result - one helium atom. Again, the lost mass is coverted directly into energy. This reaction loses considerably more mass than fission reactions with uranium, and therefore produces a lot more energy. Also, the reaction doesn't rely on radioactive components, so the danger from that is gone. However, fusion requires such high temperatures and pressures that it's not feasible with current technology. It is possible that in the future it will be viable... There is another technology that is very interesting. Joseph Newman (Neuman?) from my home state of Mississippi had a very innovative revelation in the 1980's. Messing around with electric motor design and some fundamentals of electromagnetic theory, he determined that if the coils in a motor armature are of such a length that the electricity in the coil cannot make it all the way through the coil before the commutator breaks the circuit, then a back EMF (electromotive force) will spike through the system. The voltage of this EMF is supposed to be pretty high when measured open circuit. He decided to try out a prototype - a large motor, long windings, powered by a relatively small battery. Kick start the motor, and away it goes. Now the trick - the battery that is powering the motor won't die. It is continuously recharged by the EMF spike. In fact, a dead battery connected to the system will be recharged. Ok, so this smacks of perpetual motion... Where is the energy coming from? We're recharging a battery, overcoming friction in the motor, and presumably producing enough torque from the motor to run some sort of generator for practical use. Turns out that the EMF spike is being powered by the annihilation of copper atoms in the windings of the motor itself. Hmmmm.... e=mc2... an exceedingly small amount of mass would produce an exceedingly large amount of energy.... Remember the gasoline requirement for an e=mc2 vehicle? 1 drop for 200K? So why don't we all have a pool-table sized motor and generator in everyone's garage all powered by dead "D" batteries from the kid's toys? And why don't we all have electric vehicles that are being recharged by the aforementioned pool-table power plant? Well, as is the ending of most stories of innovation and creation, the inventor, Mr. Joseph Neuman, is insane. He's currently running a cult of some type, is a pracicing polygamist, and probably not the sort of gentleman you'd invite to watch the game with.... An electric motor company in the US contacted Neuman some years ago to offer their services. An engineer was assigned to work with Neuman and assist and observe the motor construction. His report was a scathing testimony to Neuman's insanity and lack of basic understanding of motor design. In the end, Neuman stole the prototype and it has never been recovered. Does the Neuman motor work? It's never been proven to work, nor has it ever been shown to not work. Sad that the solution to the energy needs of the future could be in the hands of such a person... Anyway, look it up! Interesting reading.... http://www.josephnewman.com http://www.josephnewman.com/JN_Theory_by_Hastings.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Newman_%28inventor%29

I was successful one time going back to an original calibration. This was back when we used the NGS thincards and programmed them in a desktop PC. Back then you could select which version of NGS software you wanted to run. Just make sure it was a date that was before any calibration updates. Then locate and load the original calibration off the calibrations disk. Wow. That was a long time ago... Nowadays, it's virtually impossible to revert the calibration. I've never been successful, and have only heard anecdotal evidence of other's success. The older calibrations aren't located on the IDS anymore at all. You only have one copy of the latest and greatest, or no copy at all. I believe that the IDS also verifies with Ford that the calibration level installed in a vehicle is the latest or not when it is identifying the vehicle. Try going to the log icon the next time you identify a vehicle - calibration levels and continuous codes are all right there for every module. Interesting that we have to self test for continuous codes, and go through several key cycles to see if we can program a module... Yet the IDS already knows - and has known since just after hooking the stupid thing up! By the way, the IDS is communicating over the wireless network (if available) during the vehicle identification phase... VIN's, continuous codes, cailbration levels, and then hop onto the internet? Big brother Ford knows exactly what we are doing with the IDS...

...sniff... It's so hard to watch them grow up. Seems like just yesterday he was working on his first 6.0. ...sniff... Congrats, dude.

Typical parts guy. "Tech must be wrong. Here, I'll prove it with the VIN..." /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/poke.gif

I seem to be unable to locate the TSB about cleaning/replacing EGR valves. Looking it up by number, and PTS reports that the TSB is outdated - no superceeding TSB... Anyone else run into this? The warranty administrator told me to claim 12650's or 6005F's...

The slop you feel before installing the rear bracket is normal. At least, the last E-series I worked on had slop in the oil lines...

Ummm - what about the air filter? Lots of oil in the turbo, loss of power at higher RPM, and low boost pressure says intake restriction to me. Has it got one of those foam pieces on the bottom of air filter element? If so, they will stop slam up and never show it. The restriction gauge would be pegged out if it still works... Long shot, but I've been nailed by that before...

Igor, hand me that wet noodle. Smack! Now be on your way, dwayne.

I understand. I didn't know anything about plumbing, residential electrical, or much of anything else about housing before I bought our first home. Large mortgage payment, plus being too dumb to know I can't do something, results in a sharp learning curve ahead. Reminds me of the time we were remodeling our front bathroom. Near the end of the project, with guests coming in the next evening, I'm putting up towel bars and a light fixture. My daughter was taking a bath at the time. (Don't worry, the light fixture was all the way across the bathroom) I finish up the wiring, mount the light, turn to my daughter and say "ok, honey, here we go!" She watched in great anticipation as I reached for the switch and flicked it on. The light lit up - just like it should have. My daughter squeals with delight, claps her hands, and says "Daddy, you did a great job. There's no fire or anything!"

I've had them trigger the glow plug lamp while driving, but the engine usually dies (or at least stumbles drastically). If the IDS or the VDR is hooked up to the DLC, then the scan tool loses communication as well. In the past, I've tracked them down to a specific spot in the harness. Shift it right there, and the truck dies. What is wierd is that I've split the harness open after replacement, and usually don't find anything wrong. I ran this by a hotline engineer a while back, and he said that sometimes the insulation on the individual wires will get perforated, and can be very difficult to identify exactly where the failure is... Anyway, sounds like you might need a harness...

So, what does everyone else here do away from work? When you finally get most of the diesel oil off your hands (except for the stains, of course!), punch out for the weekend, and leave work behind? With fall around the corner, it's time to wash out my camelback and clean my bike chain in preparation for a ride around Elvis Presley lake. Also time to collimate my telescope and see if my aging eyes can still "split" the double-double in Lyra. Venus is also a sight in the morning - I can even see it in the rearview mirror on my way to work! My daughter is learning to ride her bicycle without training wheels - a milestone - and it's a nice feeling to see her polishing the case of her 3" reflector telescope while I'm working on mine... It's funny how in the south, things start to "wake up" about this time of year. The summer heat is pretty much behind us, yet it is still definately short sleeve weather. Perfect time of year to get active outside again... So how about you guys?