Keith Browning

Hey, so what was the outcome of this? /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/shrug.gif We want to know what jet fuel does to a 6.0L!

2005 Excursion/2005-2006 F-Super Duty 6.0L - "P0402 caused by aftermarket equipment" Some 2005 and 2006 6.0l diesel equipped vehicles may set dtc P0402 (egr flow excessive detected). before proceeding with normal diagnostics, inspect the vehicle for non-approved aftermarket air induction systems, larger exhaust systems eliminating the catalytic converter, and/or performance enhancing chips/programmers which often change the dynamics in the air management system. The use of non approved aftermarket air induction systems can also contaminate the hot wire on the MAF, and cause inaccurate EGR diagnostics and function. Replacement of factory components will not resolve these concerns, and should not be attempted or covered under warranty... No kidding?! What about 2003 and 2004 models? We haven't seen this before have we fellas? /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rofl.gif

2006 LCF with intermittent surging and stalling with no codes. You just can't make this stuff up! You aren't going to believe this but they actually built another truck with a major wiring defect! The symptoms are surging, stalling and lacks power at random likely without any codes and passes all testing. This particular failure may also become a stalls/no restart or cranks/no start with fuses F1.12 and F1.46 open. (others are possible. Remove the front grille from the truck and inspect the main harness that runs from a connector in the middle of the two frame rails and goes up the center of the front of the cab and then into the cab. This harness has NO CONVOLUTE TUBING and is wrapped in black cloth tape /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rotz.gif You may find the harness tightly secured to two brackets with zip ties. The brackets have sharp edges that cut through the harness and can cause what we have come to know as PCM reset. I wiggled the harness and was able to blow the two fuses mentioned. The fuses? They power the ignition switch, ECM/PCM, AP sensor, Speed Control SW, BOO SW, IDM, the IPR and MAF. I repaired the wiring and replaced the fuses, wrapped the harness in some of that leftover tape from the 05S34 recall and some convolute tubing where the brackets are. I then re-secured the harness with new zip ties. I recommend that if you come across this also note that the harness may also contact the receiver/dryer mounting bracket as well. I will follow up this post with an article including photographs (as usual) so that you can see what this really is about. Now, would somebody advise the Mexicans at the plant that old socks are not good for wrapping harnesses!

Quote: I have a couple 2004's I service that have oil that blows up on the inside of the hood at the rear. So far no one has complained. I haven't investigated nor saw any ssms about it. Any ideas? Wow, this is the first you are seeing this? It's usually caused by the CAC tube at the intake elbow. The plastic tubes don't always seal well. Try tightening the clamp a little or upgrade the tube to the metal one with the rubber connector hoses. I have also seen am SSM on oil filter cap seals leaking from not being replaced with the filter.

I am about to begin a 6.0L head gasket job and have decided to try the cab off method. Does anyone have any last minute advice. What is better to use as a lift point; the metal edges underneath where all of the steel panels meet or use the integral beams underneath the floor?

Shawn First, welcome to the DTS! Please feel free to make posts and ask questions. I will assume that you are asking about web sites that are more technical in nature than sites with every "Yahoo" that owns a Ford product spouting off about a lot of nothing. May I recommend that you visit http://www.flatratetech.com and browse their forums. They have many different forums for all domestic lines, one for general Ford products and a couple for the diesels. I frequent that web site as well and I think you will find some very knowledgeable guys there too! But don't forget us - I believe most of us have here have knowledge of the entire Ford product line, not just trucks and diesels. You could also check out Ford Truck Enthusiasts which is not as technician oriented but you may find something there too. There are A LOT of people on that site and you will have to weed through a lot of BS... worth checking out at the least. Good post. Don't be a stranger now!

We've seen one or two in our shop. If you read the manual, you will have to remove the oil pan, pick-up tube and the valve covers as well. You will end up having to pretty muck strip this thing to get it out with the body on the frame. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif If there's a vehicle that is asking to have the body raised to do this job it's the Econoline. And by the way, replacing injectors can be nearly as painful in chassis. You either will need to lower the engine by removing the mounts (easier said than done) or lift the body several inches. I don't know how you are going to remove this engine with the body on and no lifting brackets. The one for the 6.0L is sweet!

Well I finally removed the piston and got a good look at it. It's more than a little crack and a small hole. The piston is almost cracked in half and by looking at the carbon on it it's been like this for a while. I am shocked that it lasted without coming completely apart. Believe it or not, there is no related damage at all! I have this piston sitting in a dunk tank to remove the carbon to get a better look at it.

The warranty history is not all that bad compared to some I have seen, but bad enough! I don't see more than one turbo or EGR valve being replaced, even in the "full warranty history" listing. Two different dealers as well, is yours one of them or are you the third? /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rofl.gif I see a lot of trucks that have been to one or more dealers without satisfactory results. I am sure this happens a lot. Quote: .....on the test drive about 7 miles out it started to lose power and pop out the intake, lots of smoke, "quiet" engine sound, ECT 215 at hwy speed, cackle......basically every symptom you ever heard of! Finally stumble it back to the shop. NO CONT CODES, NO ON DEMAND CODES, KOER PO2263. Although the EGR valve is new I would verify the valve position when it's supposed to be closed. The description above sounds like the classic complaints that accompany a bad EGR valve. Perhaps the intake is carboned-up and pieces are breaking of causing the valve to stick. I also see that recall 03T02 - CALIBRATION UPDATE PRIOR TO SALE has never been performed but has the calibration been brought up to the latest level??? Looking at the build date I would say that this truck is not going to be happy until all of the early build injectors have been replaced. Just my opinion. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/thumbup.gif

Yeah, I see a lot of whining and good will repairs in our shop too. What pisses me off is that it's usually the people that didn't buy their vehicle from us and or have never been in for service. Now, with 70K on the clock, they expect Ford (the dealer) to fix it for free. So after they call Ford and start all kinds of crap we end up fixing it... and never hear from them again!

Technically, we are not supposed to service the injector sleeves after a copper seal failure. They are to be replaced. I think it's a judgment call but any major pitting or burning is not cleanable. I do have something you could try... I used one of the wire brushes in the 7.3L kit, not the "twirly" looking one but the one that is straight like a little round broom. Since we have two in our shop, I removed the plastic handle and put it in a right angled drill. For all intents and purposes, I reconditioned the injector sleeve. I only needed to remove a little carbon so it went quickly and I doubt the sleeve was damaged at all to begin with. It's worth a try. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/shrug.gif

A 2004 F-350 Harley Davidson w/6.0 rolls in with a list on the RO, no service work requested. Last line on the RO was a concern of coolant stains all over the engine. The OASIS shows two dealer visits within the last 3000 miles at two different dealers with the same concerns. After running down the diagnostics in the recent TSB on coolant over flow, nothing turned up leading to head gaskets. It has a K&N "engine duster" intake, 4" down pipe to the stock cat then a DUAL 4" exhaust. The PCM data shows the last reset 37 miles ago, with 8 codes in it, engine over speed, a P1000 and mostly corrupt PCM data codes and communication faults in all other modules. And, heh, the VIN block is blank. I called an engineer. What do you think the chances are this dude has been tossed out of the other two dealers? I did not find a programmer in the truck but I smell smoke! Waiting for Svc. manager to make a decision.

Quote: Nav did some checking into this last year, and found that the majority of the "bellhousing" leaks were related to assembly lube leaking out of the torque converter, over time. Yeah, this fooled a lot of us. My first experience with a 6.0L leaking started out blaming this grease and ended up being a rough casting/machining of the bed plate sealing surface. The pictures of that one are in the Photographs gallery. Ironically, I discovered that the grease also reacts to a UV lamp and looks similar to oil with dye in it. I learned the hard way as this was before Ford put out a special service message on it. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/banghead.gif

I discovered something in an engine I disassembled today that I consider a little strange. The piston in cylinder #7 developed a small crack about 3/4 of an inch inside the the bowl in the top of the piston. It progressed into a pea-sized hole as combustion heat began burning away at the metal. It actually looked like someone took an acetylene torch with a cutting tip to it. Nice and clean too. No damage to the head or cylinder walls either. I thought I would mention it just for interest. I have never seen this type of isolated failure on a 7.3L. Has anyone else??? When I get this completely apart and cleaned I'll photograph and post it.

Don't feel bad, the Ford versions of these engines (i.e. Power Strokes) don't record or time stamp data either. We do however get "freeze frame data" which is a snap shot of certain parameters when a code is set. Unfortunately the data recorded isn't enough to be of much help but it does help indicate the conditions the code or fault was set.

I keep reading over and over again that "the dealer replaced my rear main seal for the bell housing leaks" and the posts usually mention several repair attempts to stop an oil leak. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rotz.gif The amusing thing about this is they almost always report that the leak is still not fixed and turns out to be something else after replacing multiple rear seals. I personally have yet to see a single rear crank seal leak but that's not to say that it doesn't happen. Just about every possible source of engine oil leaks on a 6.0L PSD shows up at the bell housing sooner or later. Amazing but it's true! So let's try to get to the bottom of this oil leak enigma and collect our own data and come up with the most accurately common sources of oil leaks. Please participate in this two part poll and feel free to post comments as well.

It is OK and as far as I know that's the only way to get one. It comes complete with pulley, field and clutch. Ford bounced the claims because we used Motorcraft parts instead of new, which is not available. I am sure it's an administration error that they need to correct.

Quote: I know this post is a little dated. It's NEVER too late to add useful information and helpful advice!

I have been on vacation since I looked at this truck (new baby) and I actually went down to the shop to look at it because nobody else knows how. I made some suggestions to my manager but I don't know what the outcome was. I also recommend looking at the ICP connector because they have been a real problem, and not just the recalled model years either. It's the same stuff as what's on the 6.0L. I will add a post when I know more.

Quote: Every Nav engineer I know notes that they consider the 6.0L as being "chipped from the factory." None recommend any sort of power mods. That has been my position from the beginning. Many owners don't realize that these engines are cranked-up versions of Navistar medium duty designs. Great post by the way but I don't see how it ties into the quote. I think it's funny that chipped and stock engines both exhibit coolant puking and many customers fail to see why the chipped engines are not warranty. Seems like an unfortunate paradox and even "we" have to admit that the rules are sometimes unfair.

9/30/2005 - I heard on the radio this morning that the last Ford Excursion SUV rolled off of the assembly line this morning. For what it's worth I thought it was one of the best vehicles for it's purpose ever made. At 19' long with the aerodynamics of a brick and fuel guzzling engines it's no surprise that this monster family hauler suffered from slow sales. Given the current fuel situation, the national average to fill the X's 44 gallon tank is around $100! Personally, if I could afford one I would own one and probably a diesel. Maybe in the not too distant future I will stumble upon a nicely kept used Excursion but I think I might actually prefer a 7.3L over the 6.0L. At least it's not a sad good-bye, they will still be visiting us in the service bays for some time to come.

No need to apologize guys, I just wanted to make sure things don't get out of hand. If you guys think we need one, I can open a board just for bitchin.

I am glad that we were able to assist you! This is what this web site is all about and it's nice to see it in action. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Okay guys, PLEASE! I have to ask you to back off on the shop politics. The tone of this thread is no longer professional in my opinion and this is indeed not a "poor me crying site" or a "Ford bashing site." This is a technical site which was the intention from the beginning in an effort to get away from this type of posting. I am sure we are all in agreement that this web site is a safe haven for techs to gather and share information in a kind and professional atmosphere and since it's beginning it has been that way. We will not lock threads to end disruptions on this web site - we will warn and then suspend members. :ban: If you disagree with this policy please PM me and we will discuss the matter. I am honored to be in the company of the members that have already joined us. All of you are welcome here and I look forward to our continued growth therefore really don't want to have to cast anyone away.

Quote: First off throw the NGS away when it comes to the 6.0. Its unreliable and gives false readings. WDS it the tool, unless ou have a PDS. I was referring to the way I used to run the test on a 7.3L. My point was that the newer engines that don't have the ICP sensor in the pump cover don't give you a way to measure deadhead pump pressure... or have I missed something? And yes, a stethoscope is a must have with this procedure. If you can identify the leak at one side or the other without any major parts removal you will save a lot of time. Quote: And actually, since the low icp is present at ect's at or over 175f or so, by the time you air test the thing is cool again, thus inaccurate readings. The CrotchLine actually suggested I "find some way to keep the engine hot" Plug in the block heater! That has also helped me find leaking injectors that only leaked when hot.