Keith Browning

Good advice and I tried to back-up this information with a spec on the pump. Here's the funny part quoted from the PCED: Quote: With the high-pressure pump effectively deadheaded, crank the engine and monitor the ICP PID. If a low pressure condition still exists, the problem is most likely with the high-pressure pump or the high-pressure pump drive gear. I'll be damned if I can find a specification anywhere and how would you read the pump pressure on a 2004+ engine? I remember doing this on the 7.3L using one of the oil feed hoses and one adapter to use the ICP sensor and monitored the PID with NGS. Can't do that on a 6.0L!

'06 LCF 4.5L code 333, inactive of course. Code 333 is "ICP above or below desired level." This is similar to a P1211. The truck reportedly had a lack of power with a check engine light on. It passes all testing and the code or symptom has yet to return. Anyone run across this yet?

Are you Gentlemen trying to scare us? Well, let us hope that this engine is a winner because otherwise... /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/hitthefan.gif

I know that there was a recent SSM or TSB on compressor failures on 6.0L equipped trucks but I have now seen two compressor failures on LCF trucks (w/4.5L) The compressors start to make noise with very low mileage and fail in less than 1000 miles. Keep an eye open and an ear tuned to this potential! The good news is that on the LCF the compressor is VERY easy to replace in contrast to a 6.0L van or truck. If you can't find it, the low side port is behind the rubber trim on the bottom of the cab just to the right of the left headlamp as you face the truck. It took me a while to locate it. One important additional note: The compressor ASSEMBLY is only available as a Motorcraft part. Soooo, submit the warranty claim on a new truck and see how fast the claim gets bounced back!

Quote: Sounds like you need a hug! You ain't right Ed. I do agree that walking away from a problem vehicle to come back later with a clear head is sometimes needed.

To the best of my knowledge there are only two booklets. I could be wrong but there was the original release and then the early '05 release that included the Econoline. I was expecting some kind of a running change publication release for 2006 MY and I haven't seen anything. I think the 2006 model has very little if any changes mechanically from what I can tell. By the way, I have a digitized copy of the "Bibles" but hesitate to put them up. I need to be careful about publishing copyrighted material. International allows the use of their images and logo but I don't know about printed materials. I know the booklets say Ford on them but they are actually International pubs

Quote: ...But anyway I had an 05 that was dropping boost and it was not all the sudden.It was gradually pushing the blue tank seal out from around the intercooler slowly and you couldn't see it for those rubber radiator baffles.I found it by holding brake pressure and boosting truck while someone listened for air outside the truck.I hope to keep learning from this site in the future.Thanx Thank You! Something to check for although I did look. My customer's truck would actually present the turbo/intake flutter sound when this happens to him so I am fairly convinced that something is causing the turbo to return to it's default position..

Nobody, including myself has stated the obvious. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rofl.gif If you don't have any scan tools that will allow you to connect to these trucks to perform self tests and monitor parameters then may I respectfully recommend that the U.S. military get some appropriate diagnostic equipment? Working on modern diesel engines, computer diagnostics are a must!

Paul, 1st post... welcome to the DTS! I personally have no advice for you but there is a reason for my reply. It looks like you went after the items most of us would have focused on and or replaced. I JUST had a customer in with a 2005 F350, 6.0L as well doing the same thing but only when towing 9K travel trailer on hills at a steady throttle. I found nothing wrong with the truck but we know something is obviously going on. I did replace the EBP sensor with the latest level part and the customer decided to give it a try. I also read a similar post on the Diesel Stop boards just like this. I think this is a 2005 problem that is developing... I do think that we need to involve the HotLine and or submit concern reports as this may be something engineering needs to look at and quick! I have a theory that the calibration may be attempting to limit an over boost situation and the parameters could be a little to tight. With all the apparent head gasket issues and coolant puking it might make sense. That's just a theory of course. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/notworthy.gif Good post. Anybody else see this?

Put me in Coach! If you build it, they will come... NJ and VA are not that far away!

Rob, It's an honor to have you and welcome to FDDTS! Before anyone jumps on this, What kind of diagnostic equipment to you have and can you monitor engine/PCM parameters with a scan tool? I also noticed a post on the FTE web site... are you using jet fuel in these trucks? (JP8)??? The oil on the glow plugs could be because oil sits around them on the head and when you remove them the oil tends to coat them. This is not always the case though and if they smell like fuel you may have a big problem. It could be a fuel or injector related concern... due to the fuel or you may be developing a compression problem. The big factor and unknown is what exactly is jet fuel, how does it differ from diesel and what does it do to seals, how does it burn etc... most importantly, get back to us on the first questions above in bold.

Try taking a look at this article: 6.0L ICP System Leaks I realize that you have already performed the ICP air leak test but the test sometimes does not reveal a failure. Take a close look at the photographs. You may actually need to do some disassembly to fully inspect the system seals. What is not pictured are the crankcase to cylinder head oil feed tubes. You will want to take a look at those seals closely as well. You sound as though you have good equipment and service manuals, are you using Ford publications and the WDS?

Welcome to our community Sajeev, you are from Bahrain, an island country of the coast of Saudi Arabia? Just to satisfy my curiosity, do read and write in English or are you using a any type of translation software? On to your post: I noted all of the parameters that you listed but there is no mention of fuel pressure. For this engine to run well you will need to maintain a fuel pressure of 45psi or higher. You may not too far off looking for a high pressure oil leak as you might have an injector inlet o-ring starting to let loose. I have also seen the high pressure oil pump outlet fitting separate and leak. Generally these failures cause an engine to not start when hot if the leak is small. A large leak will cause a no start at all times. I am working on an article about these seals and hope to have it finished very soon, hopefully soon enough to be of help to you. Let us know about that fuel pressure!

First, welcome to FDDTS and do feel free to participate in any topic. It is refreshing to hear a manger's point of view and opinion. Also, please extend an invitation to your diesel guys to join us. John, with the numbers you present your lack of sympathy is warranted. I do not know what other technicians earn but there are just too many variables that effect everyone's bottom line to simply lump us all into one demographic. So I will speak for myself... $85,000 to $105,00? As a full time Ford diesel technician performing 90% or better warranty work? Sorry, that is not realistic. I am well paid per hour and have a guarantee which I generally draw every week therefore I will probably never see those yearly figures as a diesel specialist. The technicians I have seen over the years making those kind of figures either spend 60+ hours on the job, work so fast and carelessly that the quality of work performed suffers significantly or they are thieves. Granted, I do much more than turn wrenches, I am also a "team leader" that dispatches, assists technicians who need frequent assistance and speak with customers. I will never be "productive" on a consistent basis. My two technicians are hard workers but making more than 40 hours is difficult for them as well, especially with a constant flow of recalls and lifts being tied-up waiting for parts. We are trying to do the work of at least 5 techs but the three of us simply can't do it. Having said that, are there any techs in North Jersey looking for a new place to park your toolbox? Perhaps the discontentment comes from getting beat up by these engines and the vehicles they come in. It eventually takes a toll on a man mentally and physically. Furthermore, I don't see too many young guys coming into this business and pretty much every other technician in my shop wants NOTHING to do with diesels or trucks bigger than an F250. It is obvious that this is exactly what you are suffering from as are a great many dealerships. Otherwise, you would not be on the Internet offering jobs and Ford would not have reduced the number of Required Diesel Labor Operations for Warranty Work as posted on FMCDealer; Dealer Communications, September 12, 2005. CLICK HERE for the post in our Forums. What everyone knows but are not admitting is: It's a giant shit sandwich and we are all going to have to take a bite!

Quote: Since we last spoke, I've had in 3 more ICP oil failures, as if on cue! Funny how that works /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif I also made a socket tor the rear ICP sensor back when we were doing a lot of recalls. I know Snap-On sells a socket for the application but I'll be damned if am gonna pay 50 bucks for it. I went to Sears and got a deep. 1 1/16 socket and shortened it to the exact length of the sensor and use it with a 1/2" universal - cost me all of $5 If I remember correctly. Works great but you need to "modify" the heat shield by the left exhaust pipe to allow the tool to slip in.

This is a part of what was posted in the Message Center of FMC Dealer on September 12, 2005. The rest of the letter had to do with training. So if you read this, all of the hard work that many of us have put in getting certified to meet THEIR standards has been reduced in value and so have we. The diesel technicians who suffered through this entire 6.0L episode are no longer required for many diesel engine repairs. If this is supposed to help customer satisfaction then how will they explain this when the "knuckle draggers" screw-up the customer's trucks... and guess who they come to and ask to make it all better. This pisses me off! Instead of providing incentives to become trained and certified and rewarding those who helped turn this thing around this is their solution, please read. To: Ford and Lincoln Mercury Dealer Principals, Service Managers and Technicians Subject: Actions Taken to Facilitate Diesel Vehicle Repairs OVERVIEW There has been a steady increase in 6.0L diesel traffic which is creating capacity challenges for many of your dealerships. To improve your dealerships' ability to complete diesel repairs in a timely manner and continue to satisfy this very loyal customer base, Ford is announcing a number of changes to diesel guidelines. ACTIONS TAKEN TO FACILITATE DIESEL VEHICLE REPAIRS The following actions have been taken to improve the dealers' ability to manage diesel vehicle repairs: 1. Reduction of Required Diesel Labor Operations for Warranty Work The list of diesel labor operations has been reduced to a minimum number considered critical to ensuring a properly repaired vehicle. The current diesel labor operation list has been reduced from approximately 106 labor operations (varies by model year) to 34 labor operations mapped to specialties 51 (Diesel Engine Performance) and 52 (Diesel Engine Repair). This results in a 44% reduction in the volume of work required to be done by a diesel certified technician. This change is effective September 15, 2005. Please note that for the labor operations shown in Attachment 1, a diesel certified technician must perform the repair, be identified on the claim and must have documented time assigned to the repair in order for the claim to qualify for warranty reimbursement. Any labor operations that are performed by a technician that is not diesel certified are ineligible for warranty reimbursement Please refer to the Warranty & Policy Manual (page 1-9) for additional information.

I was cleaning out a drawer recently and came across an old pneumatic SPEEDOMETER CABLE grease tool and the stupid thing still had grease in it! This qualifies as a useless tool and pretty much unused for sure. When was the last time you saw a speedo cable anyway? With the exception of some socket sets and wrenches, it also qualified as one of my oldest tools. I tossed it! Can anybody top that?

Well, somebody asked if these sensors leaking oil was common, I actually thought it wasn't a usual problem. Well I had another one today! Thats three in two weeks just out of the blue. This last one had a voltage/signal problem and I only discovered the oil leaking after removing it. Funny how the oil sometimes travels up the wire sometimes. And then you have the ones coming apart that work just fine. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

2006 LOW CAB FORWARD - NO OR LOW CHARGING SYSTEM OUTPUT Vehicles built before 08/08/2005 may have low or no alternator output caused by a contact brush not contacting the slip ring. Perform normal diagnostics and inspect the alternator build date. Alternators built before 07/09/2005 are affected and should be replaced. Reference SSM# 4772

I'll tell you what, after driving LCF's around a little I actually found that the twin turbo set-up is very smooth. The engine winds up fairly quick and strong all through the RPM range. I was still looking for that VGT kick and the extra RPM's of the 6.0L but I reminded myself that this was a different animal. I think that a twin turbo set-up like this on the 6.4L shouldn't disappoint. I have pic's if anybody is interested. (of the twins, not the 6.4) I also had to replace a seized A/C compressor on one of our new units. They are arriving from a body company (Unicell) I think in Indiana so they already have almost 800 miles on them. This is an easy engine to work on due to it's smaller size and the LCF chassis.

I could have written the same exact post with my experience. The paint was THICK and where there wasn't paint, the tape seemed to be super glued on. I had spent over an hour cleaning that thing up and I too had to chase some threads.

Did they look like this? /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif

Okay, sorry to drag this topic from the technical to the political but I have recently seen a new resurgence of posts on the "other" web sites about warranty. Specifically, What's the difference between a stock truck that works really hard and pukes coolant and a modified truck that pukes coolant? I think most of us are fairly well aligned with the fact that running mods on your truck basically places the liability on the owner but there is an argument going that in the same shop, non-modded trucks get a warranty repair where the mopdded trucks do not for the same failure. How do we justify that? Is it a valid argument? Is it really left to our judgment or are we simply to apply the policy as Ford has it written? Grey area... maybe. Opinions?

I wouldn't say they are problematic as I haven't heard too much about them leaking. I do remember Grampy Jim posting something on one recently and I just replaced one last week for an oil leak. This was the actual sensor... also posted in the Photographs section on this site.

You are not being a bother, asking questions is what this site is for. Are you aware that the ICP sensor is located behind the IPR? The IPR is the regulator and IT has a two pin connector. The ICP has a three pin connector. Welcome to the wonderful world of the 6.0! Getting to the sensor is not easy and there are two ways to do it according to what I hear. Some guys swear they can get to it from under the truck after removing the heat shield bolted to the back of the pump cover. I remove the coolant bottle and the FICM/bracket to get to the sensor or regulator. Either way it sucks to do in an F-Series truck.