ChristopherH

Ouch!!! I've been following the news on the Big Three for a while now and it seems that most of it is bad. When you see it layed out like that in those stories it really hits home. I noticed on the news that they said 3 million or so jobs would be lost if the 3 domestic automakers failed, but I think their number is off quite a bit. What about all of the dealerships, parts suppliers, financial entities, etc? Right now, I'll admit I'm worried. I am glad to be working as a technician though--because even if people don't buy new cars, they still have to repair what they have. Our sales, body shop, and parts dept are hurting though. One of our salesman was laid off and is working at McDonalds, another has taken a moonlight job at Wal-Mart. Our body shop manager says the trend right now is for people who have minor accidents to collect the insurance check and not repair their cars--so no work for them. Hard times are coming that's for sure.

The most tragic part of all is that all of us have been sold down the river by both political parties. What ever happened to the days when serving our country as a politician was a patriotic duty that had to be endured with very little or no pay to represent your fellow citizens? Now we have career politicians that despite their campaign promises arrive in Washington and quickly fall into the trap of special interest groups, ear marks for their voters to ensure re-election, political and social perks, questionable contributions, and the allure of a life-long guaranteed job. I don't know about everybody else, but when I read the history of our country, the words of our Founders, and the Founding Documents--it shocks me at how far we have strayed. Anybody that thinks that the election of Obama is going to bring about any real change is in for a load of disappointment--the simple truth is that 4 years of Obama are not going to do our country any more good than 4 years of Bush 41, Bush 43, or Bill Clinton ever did. At best, things will remain pretty much a status quo. At worst, Obama's genuine inexperience will land the USA in an even worse state of affairs with our foreign policy. (Anybody following the news of Russia, Iran, and North Korea rattling their sabres in the face of an untested United States President?) Everyone is fixated on the economy right now, but remember that without national security--we won't need to worry about the economy! My heart is hurting for all of us--I would like someone to run for office who doesn't care about the power, money, or what anyone but the american people think for a change. We need; Less Government, Less Taxes, More responsibility, Less Lawsuits, More common sense, Less Handouts, Less Bailouts, More Hard Work, Less Welfare, More Pride in being Americans (Not Dems or Repubs or anything else!), More Self Confidence, More Gratitude For Our Blessings, More Praise for our Military, More Scorn for our crooked politicians, More steel in our spines, and maybe just maybe (I do not mean any offense here) More God in our life. Oh, and we need some more boken down Fords too! There is my 2 cents--thanks for listening.

I hear you man--I suppose there are always a few bad apples out there. It makes the rest of us look bad though and really gets under my skin when I honestly take a lot of pride in my work and do my best to fix things right the first time and not to put unnecessary parts on.

Don't beat yourself up too bad. I think all of us were in a state of denial when we had to do our first bed-plate gasket, and yours was in an E-van! (that always starts my day off with a few choice profanities, and I try to get them done as fast as I can so that my mood will recover) Next time you'll take a look at your oil dye and quickly deduce "Oh no, not another one!"

I have heard it said before, but I still agree--let them build a few 6.0s with these supposedly "good" warranty return parts and see how far they get. Personally I take offense to someone on the other end opening a returned part box up and slapping it on a bench tester that was never designed to simulate real world heat, cold, load, no-load, and other conditions and then making the call that it tested fine and was needlessly replaced! How many sensors, electrical parts, etc. have you tested with a primitive WSM or PCED ohmeter test that indicated they were good, but more advanced testing revealed the failure with the part? I doubt that they are proving these parts with any testing that isn't in the book. Plus, if the IPR has a hole in the screen, doesn't that mean the debris went through the pump to get there? Tripping over a dollar to save a dime isn't worth it. Besides what about the customer satisfaction when we under repair a truck due to the warranty screws being tightened down on us and a few thousand miles later its back in the shop again with more failures?

Pulling the cab is the easiest way--seized turbo inlet pipe to manifold bolts anyone? Those rounded/seized turbo to pedestal bolts are cake also when the body is off. At the end of the day when I go home, I am a lot more pleasant if I didn't spend the day laying on top of a 6.0 and tightening head bolts. Just my 2 cents.

Just thought I would let you know that I replaced the high pressure and low pressure turbos on this problem child on Thursday per our FSE direction. After reassembling everything and retesting, now my MGP is about 2-3 psi higher during the pinpoint test KA. The customer showed up just as I finished the job and took it for a road test--he returned and said that it is fixed and that it hasn't run this good before. However, when you run a KOER test, the truck still sets a P2263 DTC even though the MGP, EBP, etc all meet the criteria for normal operation given in Pinpoint test KA! That's kind of a head scratcher for me, our FSE, and engineering. My theory is that something with the test parameters in IDS is out of whack for a F550 manual trans 6.4--hopefully that will change with new updates. The customer is happy with the performance now, so Ford doesn't want to spend any more time and warranty $ on this one--just thought I would let you guys all know what happened.

I followed the procedure outlined in this post (thanks Alex) when I replaced both turbos on the F550 6.4 that I fixed last Thursday and it works just as reported. With these hints, it took me about 7 hours to do. On this truck it was much better, because our racks won't lift anything bigger than an F350. Also, I didn't have to unhook all of the added on wiring and PTO stuff (its a service truck). I did not have to remove any of the inlet pipes or EGR DOC pipe from the truck, so I don't know how hard they are to do with the cab on, but the turbos were not too bad. Having done turbos both ways now, I think cab on is a good option depending on the situation.

Also, just as an update, I had our FSE out here the other day for a tech assist visit on this truck. We road tested the truck together and compared it to a like vehicle. I showed him the KOER P2263 code and we went through pinpoint test KA together (again). He called a few engineers in Detroit and they gave us a list of things to check. We pulled the EBP tube, fitting, and sensor and checked for restriction--all OK. With fabricated adapters to plug the turbo inlet and turbo exhaust outlet, we filled the intake and exhaust with smoke and applied 35 psi of air pressure to them with the same result as before--no leaks found. At this point, our FSE in consultation with some Detroit engineers have determined turbo replacement is needed. They also cannot determine which one to replace based on the test results, so they want me to replace both! They are sitting here on my bench and the truck will be here Thursday. I too hate cage nuts and body bolts (the 6.0s were easier to get the cab off!)--I'm not sure I am brave enough to attempt the swap with the cab on like its mentioned in the other posts. However it turns out, I'll be sure and let you know what happens. I sincerely appreciate everyone taking a look at this and adding your 2 cents. I'm crossing my fingers--but hey this decision was far above me.

Keith--thanks for sharing that SSM. The only problem is that this truck is setting the P2263 code with the engine at operating temperature during a KOER test, and the ambient temp here is 75 degrees.

Here is a copy of the turbo specs in the 2008 WSM--as you can see, they allow quite a bit of play there. Somehow .035" radial play seems like a lot. Both of my turbos on this truck checked out at far less. (Approx. .001-.002" axial and .008" radial) SECTION 303-04D: Fuel Charging and Controls — Turbocharger 2008 F-Super Duty 250-550 Workshop Manual SPECIFICATIONS Procedure revision date: 07/27/2007 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Printable View (85 KB) General Specifications Item Specification Turbocharger Maximum high-pressure turbine shaft axial end play 0.20 mm (0.008 in) Maximum high-pressure turbine shaft radial shaft movement 0.89 mm (0.035 in) Maximum low-pressure turbine shaft axial end play 0.20 mm (0.008 in) Maximum low-pressure turbine shaft radial shaft movement 0.89 mm (0.035 in)

I'm working on a F550 service truck right now with the complaint of lack of power and when you run the key on engine running test, it comes up with an on-demand P2263 Turbo Boost Performance DTC. I followed Pinpoint test KA for this and when leak testing the intake and exhaust, I found the gasket/seal between the turbos leaking. I was sure I had found the problem so I pulled the cab and turbos and replaced the seal (The old one looked misaligned) Retest and with smoke and 35 psi of air pressure in the intake and then the exhaust, there are no leaks. BARO, MAP, EBP, EBP tube are all good. However, it still sets the P2263 DTC KOER and during step KA7 this truck cannot produce over 3.0 PSI let alone the 4.35 PSI spec. they give for the test. A like truck doing the same KA7 test produced over 6.0 PSI during this step. The PCED then says that there is a possible high or low pressure turbo concern! The VGT is moving fine, the blades all looked great when the turbos were off, and the bearings passed the clearance test in the WSM. Has anyone else seen anything like this? Under load the truck will boost 32 psi and while that seems ok and in spec, it is still low compared to a like truck. Ford and our FSE want to disregard the code and the boost issue because its in specs, but that doesn't really satisfy me or the customer on this one.

Thanks for the pics. I was wondering if your dealer is making a warranty claim on this? We had this happen to a few 6.0s, and our Zone Manager (or whatever they call themselves now) gave us hell about the last one going warranty. Personally, if the dealer is not following the storage guidelines and this happens--I don't think that we should have to do these repairs for warranty time. I was just curious.

We have three diesel guys here, and most of the time we have plenty of 6.0 work to keep us busy. (Granted, its not always the greatest work to have, but it beats no work and no pay) Since the 6.4 came out, we have seen very few of the new trucks with problems (at least compared to what we experienced with 6.0). Has anyone else noticed a slow down--or is it just us? Just wondering if I need to sharpen my skills on some other specialty areas soon!