The Perfect Storm

[Brad Clayton]

Just recently, all the stars and moons aligned in the most perfect manner. Unfortunately it was for the worst and not the better. The following description of the chain of events is almost too unbelievable to be true. I only hope that someone can read this and prevent anything of this nature from happening to them.

I would like to preface this by saying that I have worked on Mod motors since their inception. This was not my first rodeo. The engine was a 4.6L in a 2006 F-150. This vehicle was shipped to the auction and promptly sent back due to an engine noise. I got it and didn’t see anything out of the ordinary. It did have a bit of a rough idle. I chased this and after pulling a misfire code and stress testing coils and moving ignition components around, it was determined that there was indeed a base engine issue. A compression test followed by an air leak test showed a problem with the number 3 intake valve not closing fully. I tell ya someone at that friggin auction house is on their game!

I removed the right head and the valve was bent ever so slightly. I never remove only one head on a V engine, but this was going to go back to the auction. So I replaced the valve with a new one and cleaned all the remaining valves and seats. I put the engine back together and primed the motor off the starter with a remote button. As soon as she turned she made a God awful squeak and shriek noise. To say I had a puzzled look on my face would be an understatement. The engine turned a bit more then no turn at all. I was able to back the engine up and then turn it til it would stop. My first thought was I dropped something in the intake ports of left head. The point at which the engine would stop and turn in the opposite direction ruled that out though.

Now I am pretty sure this thing jumped time instantly. I pulled the cab and removed both heads. For anyone who doesn’t pull cabs on onefittys, give it a try sometime, it’s 10 times easier than a super duty. Well let’s look at some photos:
Alright the first photo is a shot of the timing chains after second tear down.



This is a close up of some foreign object damage in the chain.



Where did this come from you ask? Look at the blind holes on the back of the timing cover and you will see that the one circled aint a blind hole anymore.



Closer look.



And here is where the trouble began. I normally take left parts off and put them to the left and right parts off and put them on the right and so on. This time I didn't and I took a quick glance at the idlers and they look the same to me. A closer inspection reveals they are indeed different.



The following damage ensued:







I totally screwed the pooch on this job. The fact that I lubed up the right hand giudes with Lubriplate didn't help me any either. All the chunks were retrieved from the oil pan execpt that one bugger.

Last note, don't see to many pics of fittys with the cab off.
 

[Jim Warman]

Going out on a shakey limb (and I'm not being judgemental 'cause God knows I do it, too) I'm going to opine that you - like the rest of us - assemble stuff with air wrenches?

 

In all honesty... I think we do it too often... I think that unrealistic labour times force us to do it.

 

On occasion, I visit friends that are aircraft mechanics... they don't use impact wrenches... Cool!!

 

Yup... you got some nasty shit happening. Had something nearly similar not long ago. One head off a modular and a pebble managed to sneak into a cylinder on the opposite side. The apprentice doing the job was following the WSM step by step and we caught it (rather HE caught it) by following the WSMs advice to turn the motor two revolutions by hand and rechecking valve timing. Us old guys (yes, me included) are too good to need to do stuff like that.

 

Our youngster taught me a lesson.... or at least made me rethink my ways.

 

I like my tag line...

[Keith Browning]

Thank you for sharing your recent visit from the fuck-up-fairy Brad. Your story and your pictures will leave an impression in my mind. I have a habit of tossing EVERYTHING into a box during disassembly because, well, I have worked on ford products long enough to know what goes where. BUT! something as seemingly innocuous as an idler pulley can turn out to be quite the opposite as we see here.

[Brad Clayton]

Quote:

I'm going to opine that you - like the rest of us - assemble stuff with air wrenches?

If it has a gasket or a dowel pin then it gets hand torqued. But everyday run of the mill nuts and bolts get the 3/8 impact or air rachet.

[mchan68]

Brad, I must've looked through this thread about four times before I decided chime in.

 

First off, yes I agree F-150 cabs are LOTS easier to remove than Super Duty cabs (I've removed more of them than Super Duty cabs), simply by virtue of the fact that NOTHING on the inside of the cab needs to be touched, not to mention that nothing on the hydraulics end of the business needs to be disconnected as far as the braking system goes, and lastly, the cab fasteners actually do come out without a fight. Some members here, probably think I like to remove the cab on just about everything I wrench on which is bullshit. I only remove cabs (or bodies) on trucks that I'm removing either the cylinder head(s) or engine(s), unless it's a V6.

 

Now that we have that out of the way, come to think of it, yes I vaguely remember having a front cover off a 5.4L or 4.6L that I ran into this very issue before. The only thing that I'm scratching my head about, is why or how that threaded bolt would actually protrude through the front cover on the right side, exposing it to crankcase oil. 'Cause if this were the case, wouldn't there be oil coming out of the hole, when that idler is removed? Did you manage to actually break the front cover by FORCING the longer bolt in (with an air ratchet as Jim suggests)?The last one I had apart, I vaguely recall running out of threads in the front cover before I caught on that the two idler pulley bolts were in fact different lengths. I believe it was even on the 5.4L 3V engine that I wrenched on for a set of phasers (which made me think of your posting about the hack that ground away the front cover to access one of the bolts awhile back).

 

Hey, it happens to the best of us. I'm sure you are well aware of the 4.0L SOHC engines and their timing procedure that requires holding tools. The first one I had apart, I bent valves on it. From then on, on every 4.0L SOHC I've wrenched on, I turn the engine over two revolutions by hand upon assembly, before I reach for the key.

 

So what is the outcome of this mess, if you don't mind sharing?

[Keith Browning]

Did you manage to actually break the front cover by FORCING the longer bolt in (with an air ratchet as Jim suggests)?

Mike, the second picture shows the broken piece of aluminum from the case wedged between the timing chain and the crank sprocket.

 

The third picture shows the inside of the cover with a red circle around the broken casting - compare it to the nub on the opposing side that is still intact.

 

The fourth picture is a close-up of the broken casting where the idler pulley bolt up... where the incorrect pulley/bolt was too long. To answer your question yes, Brad broke the cover with the pulley bolt but I have a feeling you realize this now.

[Brad Clayton]

Quote:

Did you manage to actually break the front cover by FORCING the longer bolt in (with an air ratchet as Jim suggests)? I used my 3/8 Snap-On impact and she didn't even hesitate while drivin' that bolt home. That thing is pretty nasty if you let it get away from ya

Quote:

So what is the outcome of this mess, if you don't mind sharing?

Well It's hard to say where we are going from here. The truck is still apart in my bay and I am taking time off to move my daughter to North Carolina this week. Leaving tonight as a matter of fact. I can tell you one thing, I have just about burned up every brownie point that I have earned over the past 8 years at this dealer.

When I was reassembling this truck the first time, I was also having a lengthy battle with a 6.0L. I lost my shorts on that job and it really took my focus away from the task at hand when I was under the hood of the 150.

Do you ever get an idea in your head that is totally irrelavant or contrary to what is going on, but it drives your decision process anyway? Like for instance, you get a ticket from dispatch and it'll be a blue Taurus. But somewhere in the mix I heard the word red. So now I am wandering around the parking lot looking for a red Taurus. That kinda thing can derail me if I don't get my shit together right from the git-go. It doesn't help that everyone in the shop asks me a gagillion questions. I must admit that I helped create that monster, though.

The minute I was given this ticket, it was drummed into my head that this was going to the auction (translates "scrap yard" in most cases). Should this affect the way I repair a vehicle? Absolutely not! I mean some poor sap is going to wind up with it at some point in time. But it did affect the way I approached the job and it undermined my repair process which I regard highly.

[jimmy57]

OK, maybe my question is minor in the context of this catastrophe but did you see a cause for the original bent intake valve?

[Brad Clayton]

You pose a very good question and try as I might I could not determine the cause of the original failure. It was just barely bent if there is such a thing.

[DamageINC]

Goddamn, that's a rough one! I'm pretty sure I only remove one of the idlers when I do these things, otherwise I'd have likely found myself in your shoes before. Good catch, unfortunate it was too late though.

 

And yes, '04+ F-150 cab-offs are absolute CAKE. I think the quickest I ever had one off was just over 40 minutes, I was doing a short block on an '05 (stuck injector/bent rod) and had the whole job done in under 9 hours.

 

Dave

[exmod110]

My question is why the hell do they have 2 different length of fasteners? I still have a hard time with the un-uniformity of fastener sizes... I have worked on some asian and lots of domestic vehicles.. domestic requires 10 different wrenches to do a simple job and maybe 4 for an asian.......

Its like "how many different size fasteners can we use to build xxx?" instead of "how few can we use?"

It would speed up everything!!!! fewer tools, no second guessing if the 25mm long bolt goes here and the 30mm bolt goes there!!!!

Engineers/designers need a kick in the nuts!!!

Part of there schooling should be 1 year of "real world" hands on in the field training!!! let them see first hand how it works on C.A.D. but not in the real word!!!!

Yes we as tec's need to pay attention and pay attention, but its not like the designers make our life even slightly easy!!!!

 

Rant over

[DamageINC]

I'm gonna take the contrary position on that one though, I work on EVERYTHING and I will say that domestic cars are put together much more uniformly than imported vehicles.

 

I actually find German cars to be the easiest to work on, it's just that the repair procedures are usually enormous. Yeah, it's ridiculous that a thermostat pays 6.7 hours on a 4.2L Audi, it's a shitload of work. But it's easy work, there's just a lot of it.

 

On the other hand, I can't stand Toyotas and Mitsubishis, you'll pull one thing off and it takes 14 bolts, all the same hex head size and 4 different lengths with a total difference of maybe 10mm between all the bolts, lol.. do a short block on an EVO and have fun keeping track of which bolts came from where, it's a disaster.

 

(These Toyota/Lexus guys, as well as the Euro car guys have it MADE from a flat-rate standpoint though, I can't believe how generous the labor times are on these things, it really is a slap in the face to PowerStroke techs who will do twice the job for literally half of what these guys get for it, it's ridiculous. The first time I EVER did a steering rack on an Audi A4, it paid 8.4 hours I think, I had it done and shipped in under 5. And I'd never worked on one of those in my life, if I had to do it again it'd probably take half that amount of time. Compare that to a Horizontal EGR cooler which beats the shit out of you for half a day and doesn't pay out nearly what it should... I should have worked for Mercedes or something, lol.)

 

Dave

[Mbl35]

The thing that sucks about the euro stuff is you got to have all sorts of bit sockets. Like head bolts on a vw 2.0, it looks like a tripple square bit but it's different and i think i saw some 5 point hex looking fasteners under the hood of an audi once. All those tools are expensive and special order. Thats why i prefer to wrench on the domestic stuff, they keep it simple with tooling for the most part.